Clearly you’ve never been among the Forsaken enough to know that ruthless pragmatism and manipulation is part of the culture. I wouldn’t be surprised if most Forsaken knew that she was using them in some fashion and were okay with it, just like they were using her for protection, prestige, and other things. Lofty sentiment and honor don’t carry much weight with them.
13 Likes
As I mentioned above, the fundamental issue with Calia isn’t that she’s Alliance friendly; its that she’s an Alliance character who’s being forced into a Horde leadership position.
Despite Lor’themar’s awkward doting, she has no positive relationships with any Horde character; nor has really made any real efforts to do so (without Voss being an intermediary). Despite claiming she wants “to get to know her people”, she has not made attempts to do so on screen; with her never once interacting with a single one of the Race’s remaining reps (only very recently Alliance undead outside Voss). And despite many Alliance players claiming she represents the Forsaken, in reality in her current iterations she ONLY actually only represents who the Forsaken were before they died. She in no way represents who and what they’ve become in the last 18 years, including their entire history with the Horde. Instead, she conceptually invalidates all of that.
So … in essence, we have a character who: Only represents the Forsaken before they were Forsaken; Has no positive relations with any of the actual Forsaken characters remaining; and only has developed positive relations with Alliance characters. So for we Hordies, who have been subjected to a decade of massive neglect when it comes to Blizz writing up replacement characters in the aftermath of the massive destruction they’ve caused … Calia is a bit insulting.
23 Likes
Just going to pop in here and mention that a vast majority of people who support Calia being the Forsaken’s leader are Alliance posters.
Really makes you think.
29 Likes
I think they should rez early BfA era Saurfang and make him lightforged and have him lead the humans/alliance until Anduin gets back.
Better yet!!! Just take Baine now and he can do it!
;D
5 Likes
Correction: alliance players who don’t give a damn about the lore and would welcome anything just to upset the opposing faction, sadly these forums are full of that kind of players from both factions
9 Likes
At least wait till the second date
1 Like
I actually don’t think they knew, or at the very least they convinced themselves they were the exception. That while she may use and discard everyone else, she does what she does for them … and thus they were never at risk. They showed no more sign that they knew they were her Bulwark than her Arrows. I wouldn’t be shocked in the slightest to find out that even hardliners like Belmont or Faranell weren’t aware they were probably sent to Darkshore to die.
The only exception to this were probably those closest to her. A very small collection of her Dark Rangers and Nathanos. They probably are fully aware that they are tools that are at risk of being discarded, but are too enamored with her or her “vision of how the world really is” to care.
1 Like
actively making the lore worse to own the horde
5 Likes
See, I’m not so sure its that so much as they merely just want the Horde story to made convenient for the Alliance’s. So things like Baine being slowly rendered little more than an accessory for Anduin, or Calia being shoehorned into the drivers seat of the Forsaken are appealing.
Those that aren’t invested enough in the Horde to want to “own it”; but their investment in the Alliance pushes them to “nothing” the Faction as much as possible.
I rather liked Voss, but yeah I feel she’s too placid for a Forsaken / one of the leaders representing the Horde council. I feel Voss shouldn’t be killed because story / character wise she can be saved.
Personally at this point I’m leaning towards the Forsaken Kaldorei Delaryn Summermoon to make a rise-up – Heck, I’d I mean if need be I’d take an undead Hogger which I’d consider better than Calia.
/shrug
Id support Summermoon if only because the whinging will be well worth it.
As for being an Alliance poster and thus not really caring about Forsaken lore, to be honest I could care l as about any races lore. The lore in this game isn’t that good. Race lore is a constant cycle of failure after failure and any attempt to move past that will either regulate you to the Forgotten Mines of Obscurity or the Roller Coaster of Nostalgic Fail (sub orcs!).
I just find it endless amusing the hoops people like to jump to hate things.
3 Likes
Sigh, or we could just do the obvious. Build up both Calia and Voss as equal counterbalancing leaders. Form and Function. Calia represents thematically who the People of Lordaeron were in life, Voss represents fairly well who they have become in death. That way you facilitate and support both sides of the spectrum of Forsaken identity explored in BtS. Support Voss with Belmont, Tattersail, and Faranell … support Calia with Faol, Derek, and Leonid.
As for Velonara and Delaryn … honestly we still could use that Forsaken AR filled. I know “moar elves” is not the most interesting, but use the Nightfallen rigs as a base, and turn the Undead Elf factions into a composition AR. There are enough subfactions of them now to make that group interesting, and by making those two leader and co-leader you at least improve their chances of interesting development. Plus, you facilitate both the Forsaken and BEs thematically.
EDIT: While we’re at it, just give the Alliance the damned NE Worgen. Make them bigger and more feral, without the ability to turn back into their Elven forms. That might bring a bit of grey into the Blue-bloods, and would facilitate both the missing Worgen AR and thematically the NEs.
3 Likes
Id be fine with the apparent co-lead of Voss and Calia Blizzard seems to want.
The only thing I’m personally invested in for the Forsaken is Dread Admiral Derek Proudmoore, Lord of Theramore and I will die on that hill.
2 Likes
He’d be a nice cohort for Tattersail on the Calia side of that spectrum for sure. It might be fun to see a bit of a healthy rivalry develop between the two tbh.
It’d also be amusing for the race to come full circle into once again being led by a discolored nelf bouncing her boobs in the Undercity.
18 Likes
well we dont like her more lol
1 Like
i agree. i have no motivation to even serve the horde anymore. I hate the war counsel and i hate that now apparently i am being forced to kill the Dark Lady’s followers when i am one. Im not having fun at all.
3 Likes
I mean … if all you liked about the Horde and Forsaken was that they were pawns of a selfish nihilist … not sure how much you really liked either before now? Though, “the only thing I liked in the Horde was Sylvanas” … is not as rare a opinion as one would think.
4 Likes
The horde has changed a lot. I do not like that we are basically the same thing as the alliance now. Yes Sylvanas is my favorite character and i would like to continue playing with my favorite character. It docent make sense for me who followed her to the end of the war campaign to just up and betray her. Being forced to do something you dont want is never fun.
4 Likes
I mean … we kind of were from the GetGo?
The Horde is by definition an Alliance of various nations and groups, its just we happened to have had a Warchief … who’s position became increasingly dysfunctional and less practical the more groups we added to the Faction. Even before Sylvie took the reigns. In a bizarre way, because of the immense amount of shared cultural norms and lack of competition for resources within the Alliance … a High King for them actually weirdly makes more sense for them than a Warchief does now for the absurdly diverse Horde. Outside of the NEs of course … they are soul exception to that Blue cultural hegemony. Weird how things flipped like that?
As for Sylvie. Its fine you feel that way, but lets be honest. Well before now most of the reason she got away with as much as she did was because of game mechanics requiring leniency on the Forsaken’s darker side as a PC race … and her greatest of superpowers “Plot Convenience”. Thus, the problem with a PC loyal to Sylvanas now is that in order to stay and act loyal to her it would require their story to either default on game mechanics or plot-convenience to protect them. Which means that that power fantasy really just boils down to “Playing a Villain who’s immune to consequences because the Meta Game requirements require it”.
3 Likes