Finding a mythic group is is getting to be complete garbage. This kiting meta bs and everyone wants a DH show just how bad Blizzard is at balancing the game. You have ample time to make very tank class playable. Get your crap straight.
12 Likes
59% mythic runs DH. No problem here.
3 Likes
There are very few pulls where you actually need to kite. I can see the need to kite all the time or more frequently once you get to +20s, but you can face tank most pulls in +15s with good dps utilities and defensive cds.
2 Likes
People also want the 5% magic debuff is the issue as well. They still did not touch the dogs in HoA or Spires for whatever reason. The inner ring trash packs in Other Side have not been touched it feels like. Melee white swing damage needs to be reduced as in general it feels like they are doing to much damage currently. They have a long way to go to correct the tank problem.
5 Likes
| Vengeance Demon Hunter | 1968 (41.71%) | 263058 (42.9%) | 133.7 | 70.5% |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Brewmaster Monk | 584 (12.38%) | 75826 (12.4%) | 129.8 | 63.4% |
| Blood Death Knight | 412 (8.73%) | 53017 (8.64%) | 128.7 | 67.7% |
| Guardian Druid | 517 (10.96%) | 66031 (10.8%) | 127.7 | 62.3% |
| Protection Paladin | 1017 (21.56%) | 128375 (20.9%) | 126.2 | 61.7% |
| Protection Warrior | 220 (4.66%) | 27344 (4.46%) | 124.3 | 59.1% |
1 Like
Not âneeding toâ does not mean one should just not bother with nearly free mitigation for a net positive to clear times.
Also, on Fortified-Necrotic weeks, you absolutely do need to, well short of 20s.
Most of those can only be exploited⊠by kiting.
2 Likes
The benefit of not kiting is overwhelming. When you kite you miss out on a lot of dps, whether from the group or yourself as the tank. Knowing how to properly manage defensives and group utilities keeps them bunched up for cleave damage. If I kite I will be lucky to walk out with low 2k dps vs ~3.3k not kiting. Over the course of an entire run that is millions of missed out damage.
Additionally, there is a difference from kiting vs clearing necrotic stacks and going back in. On the previous fortified-necrotic on +15/16 I still did not need to kite most packs besides dogs with bleeds/enrage.
1 Like
As a melee DPS, I lose no damage over the time the tank spends kiting. I do not lose any cleave damage.
On my tanks, my potency per GCD is already in a painfully low lull period when I call out for snares or roots.
On my ranged DPS, Iâve yet to have any tank pull mobs out of range.
There is no point of âproperlyâ managing defensives that wastes the opportunities afforded by kiting. There is only improperly managing defensives, not capitalizing upon damage taken windows, that may do so.
Then youâre kiting in too long of stretches, likely not positioning sufficiently around Consecration. And a third of your damage alone, when your maximum trash damage is some 3.3k, is not likely to result in millions of damage lost.
No one was saying you should always be kiting. Only that it can and should be used in equilibrium with party damage thus dealable, rather than being ignored outright âbecause itâs ânot neededâ yetâ.
1 Like
Except its not just about you. There are plenty of casters who need packs to stay put in order to maximize dps. Fire mages are an example. Kiting lowers overall dps no matter how you look at it.
âThen youâre kiting in too long of stretches, likely not positioning sufficiently around Consecration. And a third of your damage alone, when your maximum trash damage is some 3.3k, is not likely to result in millions of damage lost.â
Keeping them out of melee range from me while kiting in consecrate is a big dps loss for me. The difference from someone doing 2.2k and 3.2k does add up to millions of overall damage.
âNo one was saying you should always be kiting. Only that it can and should be used in equilibrium with party damage thus dealable, rather than being ignored outright âbecause itâs ânot neededâ yetâ.â
I think you and I both agree that there is no absolute âneedâ to kite at this stage, until you get into high keys like 20âs. However, there is a huge population of players who are complaining saying that kiting is the only way and was the basis of my argument.
1 Like
Flame Patch and Wild Spirits are more the exception than the rule, and the latter is large enough to kite around without losing targetsânot to mention itâs quite brief and usually finished by the time one is ready to kiteâŠ
Ahh. I figured they still meant merely that are forced to kite at some points or windowsâwhich is not unlikely in Fortified-Necrotic keys without high dps or a great healerârather than that they must kite some 70+% of the time.
Personally, on my Prot Warrior, I string slightly, keeping one nearer me while just being within cleave range of all the others for everyone else (and often even Revenge, which actually swings deeper than the stated âmelee rangeâ), so I can build Rage while kiting, then unload again once Iâve sufficient Rage and/or CDs to take the full brunt without loss to party DPS, or stun, get in a final rotational, and get out til stacks are gone during Necrotic.
Admittedly, if healer DPS were more significant, or I less often had to deal with Flame Patch, Iâd probably kite more than I do now, but I donât make small use of it, and itâs had little to no impact on my damage-dealersâ throughput while making up for my own losses with the damage dealt by any but Disc Priests and Holy Paladins (the offensive throughput of which was already nearly maximized regardless).
Yeah no, most of the OPâs who complain about the âkiting metaâ are under the false belief that they have to literally kite almost every pull. A lot of that does come down to defensives and group utilities.
1 Like
Well, then I side with you on the whole / if forced to give only brief advice. My bad.
1 Like
I kite when I have no defensives/heals left or I know I need to save a cd like the first 2 pulls in DOS, etc. I still stand and tank almost every pull minus bleeds or something with no pot up. Iâm kyrian. The complaint is every other healer constantly complains stop face tanking. Sitting almost full mana. They think everyone should be running like a VDH because it makes up 40 to over 60% of the tank meta. It is the INCORRECT influence on the tanking meta and its killing finding a dam group at 15 plus. They do not even look at your IO half the time they just see NOT VDH. The âyou have to have VDH to succeedâ is screwing the game. I do not know how far out 9.05 patch is but it needs changing sooner then later. They do have a much higher success rate then other tanks most weeks so there is that also.
1 Like
What does this mean? What are those numbers?
More tank balance would be great. Buffs or a design so that kiting wasnât a thing outside of packs designed for it would be amazing.
1 Like
You canât BoP, divine shield, and kyrian your stacks off. Paladins only need to kite 1-2 pulls on Necrotic week.
Iâm assuming you mean âcanâ, but consider even then, all but one of the tanks are⊠not Paladins, and most of the time (short of high keys) will not be running with a Holy or Ret Paladin, either. Kyrian is popular among tanks, but by all means, try explaining to your local Guardian druid why he should have merely phialed off his stacks and virtually never kite.
If weâre still talking about necrotic here, guardians legendary that gives them a shield when they thrash ignores necrotic lol.
Unless they fixed it since the video, thereâs a video out there that shows a guardian Druid losing almost no health while still tanking mobs at some ridiculous number of necrotic stacks
It does, but requires that low enough damage be taken (e.g. through Pain Suppression or Barrier) that it can absorb every point of damage by the strike that would inflict it. In other words, unless the bear is invincible for the time being, heâs getting Necrotic.
Just leap away.