Twinks don’t exist at max level.
Lower levels they do.
Premades at max level is its own seperate problem.
Twinks don’t exist at max level.
Lower levels they do.
Premades at max level is its own seperate problem.
This is an important fact I want to highlight.
It is almost universally true that the type of player that likes to twink, is not the type of player that enjoys developing skills and mastering the systems.
I mean that as it relates to Dr Bartle’s Taxonomy of Players. If we divide players into 4 distinct taxonomies and don’t account for secondary affinities, the “Killer” primarily gets enjoyment from pwning noobs. From ganking questers who aren’t interested in fights. From having an OP, meta class, typically with some kind of stealth or ridiculous mobility or bursty DPS, and knowing inside that the person they just PKd is screaming at their monitor.
The “explorer” is the type of player who enjoys mastering their toolkit and understanding the system. Learning the strategies of other classes. Knowing the “right” moves and counters. The “explorer” almost always trumps the killer. The explorer would enjoy the twink bracket, except that the explorer gets no enjoyment from twinking because he would rather just test his ability at max level.
But the Killer exists and represents a portion of the playerbase. Discouraging players from playing the game is bad for an MMO. WoW understood this when they made the first 3 or 4 expansions. They knew that incorporating the killers into the community, and directing their energy in the most productive way possible was a net good for the game.
Segregating these people, because their motivations include frustrating the enemy, is counterproductive and flies in the face of that philosophy. Warmode sucks. Twink bracket sucks. RBGs sucks.
Let them exist and design the systems to reward people in spite of twinks. Twinks don’t care about the the XP or the honor (unless you can share honor which is a bad part of warbands). So introduce more creative rewards for people who do. You could have badges that follow characters from BG to BG. If someone has been topping the charts in multiple BGs, maybe killing them is worth significantly more honor/xp! That would be fun.
Premades are a little different because premades are somewhat geared toward farming… But premades are made of players and players still fit into Bartle’s Taxonomy. If they are problematic killers who just want to grief people, then they are not interested in rewards. Some of the people in Premades are definitely in this category. But not everyone.
So here is what I would suggest: Yes! Crack down on syncing. But allow people to queue as a premade with no rewards. If your group is greater than 3 people you get half rewards. If it’s greater than 5 you get no reward. People who are just jumping on the premade for the rewards would stop and that would make less premades happen. But people who just like pwning noobs would still be able to fill out the queue if they want.
I didnt even read your reply sorry. Give me TL:DR
This won’t work they will simply abuse the system. The sync exploiters are abusing the system because they aren’t good enough to play fair. They don’t want it fixed. It simply needs to be fixed and the people abusing it need to be punished harshly. Bans have to be handed out or this won’t stop.
Twinks and some of the people who run premades are “Killers” under Dr Bartle’s Taxonomy of Players. The type of person who would enjoy a completely level playing field are “Explorers”. The people who are farming the honor or XP, through premades are “Achievers” and the people who really want to talk about it are “Socializers”
Games are challenged to find ways to engage all four players types. So if there is a problem with behavior the best solution is to find a way to direct the player type doing the behavior into something positive for the game. Segregating the players is rehashing old solutions from pre-wow. It doesn’t work. WoW used to know that and they designed for it, which made them successful.
See the above post for clarification. It’s hard to summarize.
Hahahahahahaha I meet numerous “killers” irl. “Killers” that they are not.
Code for “I cant pug stomp on my twink”
Wow also changed with the times and survived. Go ahead and asked them why they removed queueing as a raid for BGs…
Go ahead Maw… Il l wait
You honestly believe that Blizzard/Activision cares more about Design Philosophy and the integrity of their virtual world now, than the guys who developed the game at its foundation did?
WoW has changed and changed the genre. I wouldn’t argue that it is better overall for those changes.
They care about money. Nothing more. Nothing less.
They dont care about you or me.
They are changing with the “trends”
I’ve been playing other toons lately, I was on one of my Horde monks yesterday, I found myself in the midst of a Wintergrasp premade, it was a glorious defense. We lost SR initially. The enemy team had more healers. They got through two walls. But we won in the end.
No, personally, I don’t agree with dropping queues with large groups.
If you click queue, you should take the queue the matchmaker gives you.
But it is not against the rules.
Until that changes, players are allowed to click the leave queue button.
Just limit group size to 3 players in order to queue for bgs.
There’s no dilemma. Playing with friends has never and will never be a “dilemma” to solve in an MMORPG.
random bg’s dying because people don’t want to play because of people “just playing with friends” is very much a dilemma.
That’s not why though. This problem has always existed.
Faction imbalance is a part of the problem. There’s a reasonable amount of time to wait for a queue and there’s… What we have.
Class imbalance is as much a part of it as anything.
The dying in a single stun stuff.
For me personally the way pvp gearing works in this expansion is miserable. I miss the way it worked in BfA and SL.
The game sucks and only exists because it’s the best MMO around. Doesn’t change that it sucks.
Premades aren’t the problem.
They aren’t mutually exclusive. Those are problems, and so are premades.
You might see them as a problem, but they aren’t why BGs are “dying”. Maybe get rid of rated BGs and lump all of them back in.
That might help the queue times.
KNow what I mean?
What is it about premades that makes them so inherently unfair (I’m genuinely asking what it is to you)
Blizzard also fragmented the playerbase with Classic and Cataclysm. How many PVPers are on Cata going to MoP(best pvp right?) Next? Or playing old classic AV instead?
faction imbalance is a part of the problem
Which is exacerbated by premades.
Pvp gearing in this expansion is miserable
You can transfer honor, and they introduced the comp stomp for easy honor. It wasn’t a struggle at all to get geared
Premades aren’t the problem
Ask the majority of players in EBGs (who aren’t in premade guilds) what the biggest issue is – you might already have an idea what the answer might be
Sorry, I should have been more specific. I’m referring to sync queue premades, not legitimate premades.
Correct, but has not existed to the extent it is now.
Sure, but that’s a player base problem
Ehh.
meh
That was the worst gearing in history wtf… also, those xpacs had as low pvp players as dragonflight and TWW. Pvp players hated it as well hence the reason they said they would never do that gearing again.
They objectively are.
This is a problem… But I can’t blame them. Classic up to MoP has server communities.