Just watched this, probably deserves more views.
I suppose I’m contributing to this degeneracy by bumping your post, but you should probably stop publicizing clickbait nonsense like this.
If you feel you’re being held back because you have 2% less mastery than the Dragonslayer, I have some bad news for you.
Yeah, it would be nice to choose between every single stat combination, including various weighting between pairings, but the more important question is whether or not the item level of the PvP vendor is on par with PvE gear.
If it is the same as say, heroic raid gear, then PvP becomes the de facto most efficient way to min/max your dragonslayer, too, and we all know how that would end.
Step out of your shell a bit. If you really absolutely MUST have that vers/haste cloak, then go run that +14 dungeon 40 times until it drops like the PvE crowd will have to do.
The only way it makes sense to provide all stat combos on a PvP vendor is if you also have a “PvP power” stat and the PvP gear is a tier behind PvE gear in terms of dragonslaying power.
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to be able to min/max my Mythic raiding character via Arena, but expecting that to make it to live is the height of idiocy.
That’s the big question.
Actually, in WoD full conquest gear was only a tiny bit worse than Heroic HFC gear in the last patch, and not too many people, both PvPers and PvEers alike, complained about that system.
Bring back WoD gear scaling.
No, the Conquest gear was i700. Heroic HFC gear was i705-720.
However, the thing to remember is that HFC had tier sets and the PvP vendor had very few item choices in terms of stat combos.
Conquest Gear was largely useless for raiding for anyone who took raiding even remotely seriously.
I’m pretty sure Warmongering Gladiator’s gear was ilvl 710, not 700. Here’s a random video of a PvP guide that shows the ilvl. Go to 16:54 where he’s hovering over a piece of his Warmongering gear and it shows item level 710 scaled up to 740 in PvP combat. The Wild gear was 700, but I don’t know when that came out versus when the Warmongering came out, as my memory is not that sharp.
Also, I know Conquest gear was largely useless for PvE content, but the system still functioned as a soft barrier, not a hard barrier, due to no PvP stats.
Gear scaling is still the right play, regardless.
Seems overly aggressive for no reason. I think the video was good and I agree with it.
How do you know it will be 2%? i don’t think it’s possible to know what the end result in stats will be at this point. If you look at the vendor it’s dripping with crit gear. I think most people would rationalize that by saying it’s just placeholder gear. Not what we will ultimately see. I’d agree, but if true then how will we know what stat combinations are actually offered and how many? I don’t think we can until it’s finally released.
With that said wouldn’t now be the correct time to raise awareness of the potential issues with the vendor and to try our best to ensure Blizzard is aware of these concerns and has ample time to correct any issues before it goes live? To me that seems like the prudent thing to do here. Of course item level matters as well. But I see no reason for the concerns to be mutually exclusive. We can talk about both at the same time and it’s better we do.
You can already get heroic raid item level gear from the casual PvP quests after working through the 445’s. PvE players still choose to just do M+ though as it’s faster, just as easy, and more enjoyable to them. I doubt this will really change in SL.
Season 17 started 5 or 6 months after the raid released. The comparison really needs to be made with the Wild gear, not Warmongering.
What we’re sort of asking for here is to put heroic raid gear on a vendor and include every single stat combo. Surely people can understand why that’s a complete non-starter.
Many, many weeks after these raids release. You had to work through the entire set of 445 gear before hitting 460s, and by then the raid was much more accessible.
If 460s had been available week 1, every dragonslayer and his brother would’ve been witching up a storm about being “forced” to PvP as part of their raid preparation.
Alright thanks for clearing that up, makes sense.
Yes most do, which is why the original idea was to have a PvP stat back, like they attempted to do with PvP power. In a world where the two types of content are so vastly different from each other it only made sense to separate the gear, so one didn’t become overwhelmingly oppressive in the other. And with a PvP stat we didn’t need 8 stat combos or whatever it is. The lack of secondary stats were made up by the fact that we had resilience. In WoD we also had the 2 set trinket bonus that was necessary for PvP, which was another thing that helped in reducing the amount of PvE shenanigans.
Above anything else, the least Blizzard can do is give us a 2 set PvP trinket bonus in order to avoid things like Bike, Drest, and Claw again. Regardless of how those items are obtained, they aren’t healthy for PvP in the slightest.
Yeah I agree, but that’s why separating PvP and PvE gear is so important. I don’t really have a good solution to this when Blizzard refuses to do the most logical thing that worked for years. Still though it shows there’s room for that level of gear on the vendor given some time.
Ultimately though I am not a fan of the vendor in SL and don’t think it will solve any of our issues due to Blizzards refusal to go full bore MoP/WoD style gearing or re-instating full templates. With that said I still support making it as good as we can IF it’s all we are getting.
Wait aren’t they making it so the ilvl will be low but then you upgrade it via conquest points to a level based on your rating? I’m not in beta but I thought I heard that. If so it kinda solves the ilvl issue and forcing raiders to PvP for easy heroic gear right? Still doesn’t mean the vendor will do a whole lot.
Be careful what you wish for.
I’m now imagining Blizzard saying, “You know what? Fine, here have every single stat combo in the game, including things like 80/20 splits on one stat vs the other, but be prepared to have to win 200 arenas for each piece to get it to max item level.”
RIP PvP alts, which was the thing I personally liked best about the WoD system. I conquest capped each week on 8 classes. Nowadays gearing more than 2 is a massive chore.
Good points and I can see it. Specifically this part here resonates with me as I did the exact same. Very discouraging thinking for what I do in the game Shadowlands is basically going to be the same as BfA for me.
I’m on Beta and the vendor is better than what we have now for sure hopefully they optimize it before goes live. The only downside I can see is currently stat allocation on gear isn’t optimal.
Sounds like a great solution to pvp gearing.
The reason all stat combos didn’t exist in the past was because the PVP gear had pvp stats which made it inherently stronger than pve gear. Now that there is no pvp stat you effectively can’t get a full set of the secondary stats you wan’t.
Great, except lets say only every other piece has haste or vers on it when I want both, I am probably losing out on 5-7% of those stats and getting some useles ones which can be a big deal. Secondary stat allocation is a large part of optimizing your character.
I’m sure you would be able to min max were you able to make it to 2400 to actually get the highest gear possible. Given the new system I don’t think the upgrade system has been fully detailed but if there are rating caps for gear level then you won’t be able to get mythic gear unless you are 2400 and otherwise it will still be a lot of farming. So this is a weak excuse.
Congrats thats what this post is about.
Most of it looks like placeholder gear so there is still time for Bliss to rectify the mistake on stat attribution.
that was before m+ and weekly chests. can never go back to the old pvp vendor without a pvp stat. it just cant work. pve has more stat combos and its easier to get higher ilvl stuff and they will never give every stat combo and making pvp easier to get than pve gear. there is no way to quantify what pvp rating = a +15. being 10-15 ilvl below a bis pver as a pvp only player wouldnt matter with a pvp stat
they can. Just use % of people that complete each task. eg if 10% of players complete m15 at current point then top 10% of arena players can farm the m15 equiv gear from arena. Ofc it won’t be perfect but it’ll be a TON better than now.
OR they can just bring back a pvp stat
I miss reforging, it was a good compromise
pvp gear scaled to 735 in pvp combat