Shadowlands Benched for TBC

It’s like you don’t play Classic/TBC or read the Classic/TBC forums. There is NO real development with Classic/TBC. There is only releasing TBC with a few minor changes.

Retail has an entirely separate and much, much larger team than Classic and Blizzard is devoting the bare minimum to that. So, you are completely and utterly off base with your uninformed rant.

The Retail story writers, graphics, levelling and ALL of the other content team members are NOT spending ANY time on TBC. The management staff for Retail is not spending ANY time with TBC. Classic can’t even get moderators in game like Retail has cause Blizzard does not want to spend the money. It gets little to nothing.

You don’t have a clue as to what you are talking about. Retail’s ‘suffering’ has absolutely nothing to do with TBC.

You actually think the very minor changes and attention that Classic is getting compared to the vast amount of effort it takes to create a new expansion is the same thing?

Good grief.

TBC classic only requires a sub like current classic.

Classic and retail both have minimum teams. I can’t speak for retail since I was done with BFA, but for classic things like botting are rampant, customer support is automated and it’s impossible to get a GM, bugs exist (that are not “in the spirit of vanilla” bugs). From what I understand retail suffers from all the same things, plus the dev team is completely unhinged.

False comparison and false equivalency. There is no art team for Classic, there is no raid content team for TBC, there are no in game moderators in Classic. I don’t doubt your claims of rampant botting, but they do have in game moderators vs Classic having probably zero.

There is no one spending time creating new quests, gear, items, classes, races, and all the the things that go into Retail.

What are you folks even talking about?

Again…good grief.

It could be easier to accomplish. I mean, it is either a matter of writing & (trying to) debug code for SL or transfer a handful of 5 1/4" floppy discs to a thumb drive for TBC Classic. Which would you choose?

I was saying the retail team is also the bare minimum, it’s going to be bigger because they are also doing the things you mentioned, but it’s still smaller than it should be. I was not disagreeing with you, I was saying both versions are in a horrifically bad state.

you know that shadowlands and Classic have different teams right ?

and every old feature they brought back was monkey-pawed all over it.

-You guys liked being able to solo visons for nice gear?!? GEARLESS VISIONS COMING RIGHT UP!!!

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why do you think BC is coming out ASAP SL is a freaking mess right now with no fix in sight its very obvious even more now that the beta just came out super quick for classic BC they need to keep subs going because SL is a sinking ship and to many hauls are already broken.

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BC remastered is already in beta. So what is the crowdsourced launch date?

They only have separate Producers…

The BULK of the developers work on both teams.

It’s up to the Producers to tell the Executive Game Director how much resources they need to meet the deadlines set forth and it’s up to the Game Director to decide what resources to put where at what time.

There is no such thing as a “retail” developer. Developers don’t go to college to learn a specific game, version or expansion.

There is no “Shadowlands Development” course at your local University. There is no “Classic WoW development” course either.

They run on the SAME engine. It wouod be an absolute WASTE to train a team of developers on the engine and then just never use them on classic because it’s literally the same game. It’s not like jumping from developing for pc and then being switched to the mobile apple team.

Apple Mobile OS development is a completely different coding language altogether than developing for windows pc’s. A Windows Developer would be absolutely lost.

WoW Classic and Retail are not only the same language, or even the same dialect, but the same accent. The onky difference is that Retail uses modern slang words and Classic uses slang from 15 years ago.

A back end developer develops back end. A front end developer develops front end. An interfacr developer develops human interfacing components. The types of developers goes on and on.

While not all “Blizzard” employees will be needed for Classic and Retail, most Coders, programming developers, work on multiple teams.

Matter of fact, if you go to employment review sites for blizzard, you will see that the majority of devs are saying the ones who are multiple teams are the ones who usually keep their jobs during layoffs.

All the employees laid off worked on only one team…

In anither thread someone claiming to be an ex dev clarified this as well.

Literally no evidence exists that says devs work on one team and NEVER work on ANYTHING ELSE. Every single company in the world that develops software, as well as every single software development college course, isndesigned around JIRA and AGILE related development structures, and all of them are designed around utilizing skillsets across all of a companies different software products.

So unless Blizzard somehow has went against everything the rest of the planet does, and has their own college that teaches people Blizzards own way of developing software from the ground up, and has decided to waste money hiring two developers when they only need one… but yet they lay off people the LITERAL SECOND they are no longer needed, and do the most cost cutting practices ever seen in the industry at every single turn…

I just don’t see it. It makes zero sense. The only thing that makes sense is that people are straight up making up lies to defends Blizzards actions because they know if it really is true, it’s going to do so much damagr to WoW after so much damage had already been done…

WoW may never be the same or able to regain the love/respect/trust of the community ever again.

WoW is the WoW killer.

That’s it. These are the jokes.
And it’s only funny/not funny because it’s true.

Which is untrue the moment you look at the credits for any of the recent WoW expansions or any other MMO on the market.

That doesnt really mean that Classic has a large team.

No one is claiming this.

You really never heard of animators, character artists, environment artists, VFX artists, etc.

Even if you look at SLs credits: Youll see a good number of the is under “Design”.

You can scroll down to “Engineering” tab for SL – and see “Classic Engineers” and notice its a 7 people. The entire back-end for WoW Classis is a seven-person team minus the producer and then whatever support staff works on it (since the support staff isnt separated for either version).

Dude, Classic WoW’s dev team is literally small.

7 Classic Engineers
1 Classic Lead Engineer
1 Executive Producer

Its less than 10 people via the SL own credits. And if you want to claim that “SL credits doesnt include the whole classic team” – you can run the WoW Classic credits to see WoW Classic has the entire WoW team (retail and classic) in its entirety listed.

So unless you want to be disingenuous and claim that Steve Danuser is writing quests for WoW Classic (since hes listed as Lead Quest Designed in WoW Classic credits), WoW Classic’s dev team is literally less than 10 people.

So wait.

You still think Artists, Janitors and Quest Designers are software developers?

Shadowlands had great promise, but is quickly becoming my least favorite expac… that’s saying something. Bad time hating, horrid story telling, and hear grinds that make nothing worth while.

Now if the patch doesn’t release until March?.. screw it, I’ll train next expac if we go back to Azeroth. For now, this story and gameplay sucks.

Are you saying Animators and Quest Designers are not developers? They are listed under the dev team via their own credits.

Your attempt to throw in janitors in there just shows youre either trolling or being purposely obtuse.

Unless you are trying to claim that the literally section labelled “Game Design” isnt the dev team for the game.

Okay so here is what Western Governors University provides to kids who aren’t sure what they wanna be when they grow up.
Google it yourself for confirmation. Can’t post links here.

And no. Artists aren’t even in this list. Most people know the Art department is always it’s own department. Sometimes they merge with writing and design, calling it the “creative” department.

BUT NEVER, WITH THE DEVELOPMENT/PROGRAMMING DEPARTMENT.

Those guys prefer to work in the basement with the lights off, or cover the top of their cubicle with a makeshift roof for perpetual darkness while coding…

October 30, 2019

Video game industry jobs: designer or developer.

It’s easy to understand why so many people dream of making the next Mario Kart or Halo. Gaming is an extremely popular hobby all around the world. It seems like an amazing prospect to turn your hobby of video games, into a career. While making video games is a very exciting prospect for many people, some don’t know that there’s a huge difference between game development and game design. While video game designers are involved in all the creative aspects of making a game, game developers or programmers are responsible for the actual coding and technical aspects of putting a game together.

If gaming is your passion and you dream about turning that passion into a career, it’s vital to know if a future as a video game designer or video game developer is the best fit for you.

What can I expect as a game designer?

Before you decide if you want to be a game designer or game developer, you’ll need to know what each of those job titles are responsible for, how to get started, and what to expect. So what should you expect if you decide to become a video game designer?

According to the[ Bureau of Labor Statistics,] video game designers work for production studios, large and small, and they are the dreamers that envision everything about what the game. The team of game designers will start by writing detailed descriptions of their ideas for the game, including the plot, characters, and gameplay. The best game design concepts are selected to move forward to production. Game designers will work closely with the developers and artists to make sure the game designs are being followed. Game designers usually use scripting languages that allow them to test concepts within the game design.

There are multiple kinds of job titles for game design including lead designer, content designers, game mechanic designers, level designers, and writers. Each of these job titles in game design contribute something unique to the overall game design team.

Lead designers collect and organize the ideas into a cohesive document. They manage the work tasks, schedules, and documentation for the entire team. Lead designers are in charge of helping with new ideas, problems, and the entire process of the game design.

Content designers need to have creativity, because they are the brains behind the details of the game design. They focus on the plot and characters for the game design, and they have to help set a realistic strategy for the game’s universe. They are involved all throughout the game process to offer their insights and ideas.

Game mechanics focus on the specific pieces of gameplay that make it a game. Their job titles actually depend on the genre of video game that they are working on. For example, if it’s a fighting game, they’re called combat designers. These game mechanics focus on the specific elements of a game that help it function within the overall game design.

Level designers create the environments that characters will live in within the video game design. These designers choose the appropriate setting to help players really get into the game. Dark, shadowy environments or bright cartoon-esque areas can make a game feel more interesting and exciting.

Writers have the role of creating the text and dialogue inside a video game. Some video game designs rely heavily on conversations, and writers have a lot of work creating the scripts. Other genres have less need for writers because they are more based on puzzles or formulas.

Video game designers and the skills they have are key to making sure the game is created in a way that will be cohesive and enjoyable for players. Their work is the basis for the story, characters, and inner-workings of the entire game.

What can I expect as a programmer/developer?

Video game developers have a unique perspective on a game. They see lines of code that determine how the computer will handle everything in the game, from the rules to the graphics. Programmers (often called developers) build the video game from the ground up, under the guidance of the development team. The game developers will use different types of coding languages depending on what they need to do, and what platform the game is on.

There are many different types of game developers involved in a video game development. There will be a lead programmer, artificial intelligence programmer, graphics programmer, network programmer, physics programmer, tools programmer, and user interface programmer. These different kinds of jobs will all play important parts in the creation of a video game.

The lead programmer will assign work and develop schedules for the rest of the programming team. They are well-versed in code, but spend a lot of their time in a supervisory and management role. They meet with other departments to discuss issues and find solutions during the development process.

Artificial intelligence programmers will create the reactions for computer-controlled opponents and allies based on a player’s actions. AI enables the computer characters to respond realistically, and strategically to the player. Some video game design will require more advanced AI than others.

Graphics programmers create the tools that allow the artwork of a game to come alive. They use math knowledge to implement complex algorithms and produce 2D and 3D graphics. These video game developers work closely with artists to figure out how to incorporate the artwork into a game.

Network programmers write the code that enables gamers to play online, across the world. They develop security measures that prevent cheating, and make it possible for players all around the world to compete against each other.

Physics programmers set up the laws that a game should follow or ignore. This could be gravity, environments, weather, and more. They use coding to create the rules of the game, guided by the designers and their vision for the overall game. They determine how the different objects of a game will interact, they code in the explosions, splashes, and collisions involved in video games design as well.

The tools programmer writes code to automate tasks, making the overall development easier. They write code that simplifies the process of creating new levels, or importing artwork into the game. Their job usually depends on what the specific game will require.

The user interface programmers create graphical menus for the game. These can vary from simple to complex. They also build the heads-up display, which is vital for players. They usually work with designers and artists to make sure the systems are straightforward, and align well with the game design.

Game programming is vital to make the actual idea of the game come to life through coding. Without the work of game developers and their programming, there would be no software and no actual game to play.

I’d rather go with the World of Warcraft Credits to their own games than some no-name online university says.

Glad you spent that time on Google, instead of actually booting up WoW to look at the credits.

So true WGU. So true.

I just looked at it and found where you were looking at the Network Engineer section.

That’s just Classic.

Your whole argument… not the WoW Re-release.

And they are all listed under the same thing in WoW’s Credits. Which you have yet to disprove except by quoting a third party instead of disproving the main source.

Also wrong. Try running the credits. Engineering is related to anything under the technical end of their Game Design section. Thats why anything related to Classic WoW is either in the Leadership or Engineering section.

Because there is no need to craft anything new for Classic WoW anything related to content creation wont contain any part of a Classic Dev team.

If you don’t like SL, don’t play.
Pretty simple - no one is forcing you to play SL, Classic, TBC or any other game.