Set Our Expectations Please

(Bertimus) #1

It’s getting hard to continue to give feedback without some kind of direction. Many of our classes/specs have problems and/or holes to fill that simple numbers tuning does not address. So many threads here with legitimate points. The general attitude on classes in this expansion is that they’ve taken a step back.

We have seen a lot of content previews. We have content to test on the PTR. I still don’t care about the new content at all if I dislike my mainspec, which I do. What are you doing to address this, and at what level should my expectations be? You said that major changes are probably out for this expansion. Can you more narrowly define the difference in a “major” vs a “minor” change?

For example, we’ve seen new PvP talents. Can we expect more? Can we expect any new PvE talents? Can we expect any talent shuffling? Changes to existing talents? I just need more to base my feedback off of. We’re not getting directed replies any more, and direction is too ambiguous to have productive feedback threads. We don’t know what’s on the table or off the table. How do we offer suggestions on things we don’t like, while still remaining within the scope of mid-expansion feasibility if we do not know what that scope is? If you really care about our feedback, I feel like some of this communication is necessary, or else we are all just wasting a lot of time here.


A lot of people have been sticking around assuming that there would be class updates in either 8.1.5 or 8.2. We saw pretty robust class updates in 7.1.5 during Legion and a lot of people are kind of basing things off of that. Nobody is satisfied with their class, though. If they’re just left alone, subs are going to plummet even further over the course of the expansion.


I get the feeling they’ve pulled basically the entire class design team and put like 2 people on essences, and the rest on 9.0 revamps.

They don’t wanna tell us that, so they’ll just be silent I suppose.

Worst case is though that they’re doing nothing, communicating nothing, and not working on the future either. Lol.

(Jape) #4

Pretty much only checking the forums for continuing class balance changes.

Ptr character wipe means no more significant essence testing even though a bunch of stuff changed.


Ive pretty much giving up on any hunter updates for 8.2

(Bertimus) #6

I mean obviously I care most about hunter, specifically MM hunter since that’s my long-time mainspec. But it’s not the only spec that has giant design holes that don’t make sense. These specs should not have been completely redone going into BFA if the resources were not going to be available to make them work through the expansion.

(Xalea) #7

Agree with OP. I look at my long list of 120s and just don’t have any desire to play them, really for the first time ever in 14+ years.

It feels like staff at Blizz has just been cut and bled out. I just get a vibe that there are fewer people working on any of this, which makes it all worse, which makes people want to jump ship, which leads to even fewer working… you get the idea. There’s just overall less in all areas. Even the new zones on PTR are the smallest I’ve ever seen. But again, it’s not content that is the issue it’s the state of these ungodly boring classes.

(Belerian) #8

Sub ran out yesterday. Even the “better” (in terms of gameplay) classes are in no way compelling. I’m maining ret and it’s really boring. Not to speak of frost and unholy deathknights, both literally unplayable.
Not sure if there are any substantial class changes in the pipe for 8.2, but I don’t think that essences are going to fix anything.


I assume this is for the most part correct (with how things have been looking). Though its important to emphasize that essences are not “class-design” in any way really. There is the one generic “X essence reduces the cooldown of this CD slightly” essence and that is about it.

Most the class design team (along with Brian holinka who they hired as Lead combat designer in October) are likely fully focusing on the 9.0 pre-expansion revamps since they’re probably in “oh #$%@” mode after how awfully received class design has been this expansion… I am sure they’re well aware they need to make some huge changes for 9.0 or that’ll be the nail in the coffin. As for pre-9.0, they probably have a skeleton crew of a couple people maybe working in that area.

I’d say there’s next to no chance of any spec changes before 9.0… as in, get comfy with how your spec plays right now, cause its gonna be a while until it plays any differently or more fun.

(Lacryma) #10

All I know is if they continue to double down on Voidform, I will not play a Shadow Priest ever again.

Mage is just the safest bet.

(Belerian) #11

Just revert classes to WoD for the most…problem solved.:slight_smile:
No rocket science needed.


Nah, WOLK.

(Bertimus) #13

This game is a service. That’s what we’re paying our monthly subscription for. This isn’t the fortnite/apex market. Part of what we expect as part of this service is ongoing communication about the way our classes and systems are being handled. People in this game have to be more invested in a single character because of the time sink needed to get it to end-game. You have people who have been “maining” certain ones for over a decade now.

It’s hard to make this clear enough. When our favorite specs suck, the whole game sucks. Our motivation to continue subbing or resume our sub hinges big time on the company’s ability to communicate and fix stuff for us. We don’t expect perfection, but we expect better than what we’ve got now. Our feedback has to actually mean something, and when we tell you for three expansions in a row that you are going in the wrong direction, you’ve got to listen to us.


nah Wotlk healing design was terrible

non-disc healing specs just spammed their highest most expensive throughput spells non-stop because a geared tank could die in 1-2 globals on raid progression fights, while disc priests just spammed PWS non stop


it does seem like they gave up on classes, I’m worried how many people will stick around when they see no changes.

Myself I would give up this new azerite neck thing if it meant they fixed VDH and Guardians. I’d even give up a raid tier, the way I see it -enjoying my class > Not enjoying my class in new content-


My opinion on the matter is they believe that essences will help with class balancing, now i dont dps so i have no clue, but from the sound of it, it seems that the classes that are good are only getting the same boost from essences as the rest of the specs that are “Bad”

The same goes for healing specs, you have seen a significant drop in m+ dungeons because Class DESIGN is Horrid, Dungeon design is Horrid. I guess blizzard doesnt see every m+ looking for a resto druid healer. Same with dps, all the essences for heals are just buffing them all together, resto druid is getting even stronger. The difference in resto druid raid performance compared to their outperforming in m+ to other healers is not even close at all.

I am in the same boat as half my guild, where if there are no changes my 15 years of wow will be done.

(Bertimus) #17

Dude for real…

Where are the class changes?

(Bobbydígital) #18

within the essences. that should be as plain as day.

it’s sad but this is BFA. forget putting in an effort to rework classes like we have in past expacs, just push it to 9.0 while all the alternative character progression methods act as duct tape, holding the classes together until then.

(Glyg) #19

I would be absolutely shocked if blizzard actually responded to a post about class balance.

And if they did respond and said anything other than “we’ll try to communicate more in the future, sorry,” then I would think the world must be ending.

I have lost track of the number of times they’ve said they’ll communicate better going forward, and then they just don’t communicate at all.

All you can do is wait for the next patch/expansion and hope your favorite class/spec ends up on top when the dust settles.



I was having fun in 8.1 when I actually had some sort of resemblance of burst with high level azerites, but for now I will remain unsubbed.