Oh, it’s worse than what you think, even if you took every single talent that buffs PoM, it’s actually still worse to cast PoM over Flash Heal or Heal.
It’s basically something you only cast when
nobody is taking damage so you wouldn’t want to Flash Heal or Heal
you are moving, and have no more Surge of Light stacks to go through
We went from PoM being one of the best spells to always keep on cooldown in DF, to it being mathematically wrong to ever cast this spell unless you meet a certain strict set of conditions in TWW.
And my point is that priest is on par, and even better, then other classes in the game at appropriate gear and difficulty. The only issue that priest has is its lower on the rankings with bleeding edge content, or things that only 1% of the player base does.
That is not enough to call for a rework or really complain about the class. That’s, “I don’t want to be the bottom in content that’s innately not balanced to begin with”. Yeah, no one does. But we are this time. And it doesn’t mean the class has a problem.
Its fine if you want priest to be better at certain aspects. But the class as a whole, is fine. We’re not being buffed because we don’t need it for the majority of the content. We’re in a good place in both raids and mythic+ for different specs. Buffing for the 1% bleeding edge content or because “I want to do that as a priest” would put us in higher then we are now overall, when we don’t really need it.
You did an 8 and a failed 9 lmao!!! AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
You realize you proved his point, you didn’t debunk it. What a joke. Holy priest is the absolute bottom tier healer for M+ by miles. It is pathetic. A monk or a shaman can climb keys faster than a holy priest with nearly a 20 ilvl deficit. It’s laughable at this point.
Even more laughable that you consider timing an 8 or failing a timer on 9 is something to boast about when discussing the effectiveness oh a healing spec in M+.
Heck my monk can nearly fistweave her way through 8s and 9s and barely have to cast any actual heals. All while putting up almost as much dmg as the tank.
Holy is near useless in M+. It doesn’t matter if you can squeek out an 8 or even a 9. You are bottom tier, you are oom and out of manna half the time and having to drink, and you are slow. You are nothing but a drain on the timer and have no utility.
You’re point is objectively incorrect. You just have no idea what you’re talking about. Being able to comfortably do the same content every other class is capable of, is not some niche design choice, it’s expected.
What are priest better than other classes at? I’d love to hear this from the guy who proudly “failed a +9” the other day.
Except the problem of our extremely limited mobility.
The problem of our lack of an interrupt or really any group utility at all.
The problem of our unhealthy damage pattern that we live or die by in shadow.
The problem of our overall squishiness and lack of defensive options. Oh btw, shadow is still taking a damage loss in this regard, because the top of our tree sucks.
The problem of our entire class talent tree being a mess, where half the points are completely useless for each spec.
You say high end content isn’t balanced, but we’ve seen before that the meta can be so much healthier than it currently is. This isn’t some untenable idea, this is something we’ve had in the past.
Playable /= Good
We do need it
What possible reason could you have to justify constantly asking for our class to NOT get improvements?
I decided to let my sub lapse, and I’ll check back for 11.1 or 11.2. There’s no sense in being unhappy while playing a video game. The class keeps getting lazy bandaids slapped on it, there’s so many DEAD talents with no value-add, 20 years later and the problems inherent to the class are still there. It’s just time to let it go. 20 years y’all. Two Zero.
It feels like a gambling addiction: next week, next month, next patch, next expansion for 20 years. Shadow priest is my FAVORITE spec from any video game, but to never see the vision realized isn’t good for the spirit. Damage numbers don’t make the class “good.” If Mindblast hits for 2M next week, the class is still a mess. There’s nothing I can say that hasn’t already been said better.
For what it was, I did enjoy what the expansion offered, and playing for 1-2 months is about where I have landed for the last several expansions. Once I start getting annoyed, I cancel and come back later.
Okay, so clearly you don’t understand anything anyone in this thread has said.
We never mentioned buffs, we said we want changes to how our outdated class functions. Spamming Flash Heal and Heal because our other throughput spells are numerically irrelevant is worse than when I played Shaman and spammed Chain Heal, and reminiscent of when Disc just spammed Power Word: Shield all day.
Either you’re willfully ignorant, arrogant, or both, so I don’t think I need to engage with you any longer.
It’s not worth replying to them lol. They are willfully ignoring the actual issues people are presenting (at least I hope they are; the alternative is that their reading comprehension is abysmal) and repeatedly talking about how the numbers look okay, which is especially ironic when people have also pointed out how constant back-and-forth number tuning is how Blizzard has justified doing nothing about the class being broken.
A couple of weeks ago I made the terrible mistake of looking through his logs to find out if there was value to running Prayer of Healing in M+.
Suffice to say, I wanted to scrub my eyes out after seeing the degeneracy within. Even on a low key level like 5 and under, the people he played with were constantly dying to lack of heals, and his overall dps throughout any given key rarely broke 20k. 20k dps as a holy priest in an M+, especially a low key, has to be some sort of war crime.
Ever since then I just treat him as what he is: the most unserious priest player that opposes any sort of class redesign even though the objective assessment of his gameplay can only be described as a terror to his groups.
I guess ur playing completely wrong, i’m main DISC and I do that content as shadow just to be faster.
With vampiric touch u can cleave adds that are NOT stacked, i just don’t get why don’t u like “waste” a GCD using vampiric touch, cause 1 mindflay is enuf to kill most monsters there.
And being an archon I just pop halo and it makes the job really easy, I just don’t get how is it hard to do solo content as priest.
On Shadowlands I mostly did questing and world quest as disc.
On DF I nuke most mini-bosses on world content by myself as SP.
Not being rude but, maybe u just weak on status or duno what ur doing at all.
You’re healing a key. Your tank and dps mismanaged their kicks and a big cast is going to go off when you’re not in melee range. Can you kick that cast and avoid that damage? Every other healer can.
You’re in an encounter and get rooted, then swirlies drop on your head. Can you break that root and move out of the swirlies? Every other healer can.
Can you dispel three different debuff types? Every other healer can.
What can priest do that no other healer can do? I only ask because priest can’t do a lot of things that every other healer can do and numbers can carry a class with shattered knees a long way in terms of viability.
Though I’ve found Discipline to have the raw throughput numbers required for healing Mythic +, my main gripe with the class ATM is that our utility is terrible and a complete joke when compared to literally every other class.
The fact that we still don’t have access to Silence for Disc and Holy is incredible considering the heavy focus on interrupts in TWW.
What little utility we had was gutted halfway through Dragonflight and they haven’t bothered doing any real work on the class since.
It was pretty insulting see Priest almost entirely ommitted from Patch10.05’s changelist with all this in mind not going to lie.
Thanks for the answer but I have to assume you never read or understood what I said.
I said multiple times its easy. I did it with ilevel 570 with no issues.
Given I dont play archon so maybe the halo nukes the smaller mobs.
Sound advice. I play voidweaver as I enjoy it thematically and never bothered archon.
Anyway my point was it is tedious as spriest. On all pther casters you just mow them down.
Your point about spread cleave is funny. Almost as if you never read what I wrote.
And sure I can spend 10 globals dotting everything and spread AoE it down.
Whivh is precisely my point.
My shaman clears it completely in those 10 globals.
Listen I don’t want a pis**** contest here so take this as humble as you can from me.
Maybe I just suck. But your response was rather hostile yourself.
Feel free to look through my logs and judge, I’m fine with that. Have you tried it yourself? Actually specced and tried PoH out as its intended design and use? Because in my experience numbers don’t tell the entire story. People keep complaining they can’t handle AOE damage, but I can. If a ‘terrible’ healer as myself can, what about a great healer such as yourself?
I would love to see someone like you give it a genuine try in a couple of dungeons, post some logs, and give some good data to the community.
To be clear, the issues that surround Priest is not a number issue, it’s a gameplay / utility issue.
Imagine playing the game and you never see any numbers or indication of how powerful you are. Then you play each class and spec and see how they feel in flow and function. It is at that focus as to which Priest is miles behind other classes as we play very similar to Wrath with very little changed since then compared to other class specs that have been granted all kinds of cool and fun things to do while improving the gameplay feedback loop in making it flow better and in turn makes it more fun. This is what priests lack in spades.
I am still confused how people do not understand this is a “design” discussion and how the class feels to play.
It’s always the same argument.
“But it does so much damage you seem to be bad”
Like the people telling me i am bad if i struggle at awakening the machine. When I told them 3 times by now i don’t struggle. It’s mindlessly easy. It’s just boring and tedious on priest compared to all other classes I played.
Fun fact the DF version of it was actually significantly nerfed compared to when we first got the spell in TBC and pretty much all the way up to when it became a holy only spell in Legion. We rightfully complain about the gutting of Mass Dispel but PoM is probably our most nerfed spell of all time.
