What ya gotta do is get yerself a lady-friend who’ll pocket heal instances for ya’s. Then when the dimwitted DPS feel like tanking, ya just turn to yer lady-friend, who’s on her computer right next to ya’s, and tell her not to heal those short sighted DPS.
They die, lose armor durability and have to run back to the instance. Eventually they’ll learn, or drop from ya group. Then PRESTO! Problem solved.
Your first issue is that you’re prot and have no rage generation.
Your second issue is that you’re not spamming Demo Shout enough.
The simple reality is, if DPS do not wait to AOE (esp in the case of warriors and mages), you literally can never hold threat. There is nothing in the game that can compare to a 2H cleaving whirlwind warrior in threat, especially when they charge and instantly go to town.
I have tanked/healed everything up to Mara so far as a druid. Its literally impossible to hold multi-target threat if DPS don’t focus single target marks (aka don’t aoe instantly). Sadly the patch for classic is so easy it doesn’t matter at all, there is absolutely no need for CC and real tanks. This makes both tanking and healing incredibly unfun IMO as you are basically worthless as a tank and as a healer everything is taking damage and its just crazy constantly. Now its super fun as a DPS, you don’t have to worry about CC, about threat, really about anything except big numbers.
Overall it wouldn’t surprise me if the current dungeon structure of being too easy(basically no1 leveled while dungeons were this easy), or being a PITA for tanks/healers causes quite a lot to quit.
Agree that if you want faster leveling speed, sure, Arms beats Prot. But that’s not the same thing as saying Arms is best for tanking.
I think the threat talents in Prot blow away anything you can get in Arms. Defiance is a flat 15% increase in threat. Improved Sunder means 5 sunders for the price of 4, that’s a 20% increase in threat from Sunders, which is your main threat at low levels along with Revenge. 1h spec is basically another 10% more threat. And Shield Slam does huge threat. I don’t think it’s close.
Impale is not all that great when you’re rocking a whopping 5% crit total. Tactical Mastery and Anger Management are indeed nice to have, but you can fit them in a prot build because they are early in the arms tree.
Apparently shouts are deali g more threat than sunfer armor, but i dont k ow if blizzard is going to keep it that way.
as a tank, you have to set the speed and be high harhar. legit tho. be the alpha ur mom wished your dad was
When it comes to pure threat, arms, or even fury is massively better threat wise. That’s why nearly all top-end tanks don’t swap to deep prot until like 50 at least. Because while leveling you don’t need the survivability talents. And the threat and utility talents in arms go way farther! Especially Tactical Mastery and Anger management which is possibly one of the most OP talent warriors have.
You should look up Skarm on youtube and watch some of his videos he’s massively way more knowledgeable than me, and can explain in detail why arms is so good for tanking.
Skarm will teach you more than posting on these forums asking people who don’t understand certain mechanics of the job to explain why you cant do them.
The Protection Talents are great for Tanking… when your stats are better. But “Defiance” 15% of low TPS is still low Threat. AND you need to be in defensive stance to receive that bonus. so you trade -10% Damage for 15% Threat. (which is a better trade at higher levels)
Keep in mind Sunder Armor can be used in any stance. & Should be on all of your stance bars.
If your level 45 arms you recieve 10% Crit from Axe Mastery / Cruelty. (Works for 1 Handed/Shield as well as 2 Handed Axes.)
I don’t know the math but 10% Critical Chance on every swing at these levels carry more weight than 15% threat in 1 stance.
I will try to watch some of his videos when I get a chance. (Can’t right now because I’m at work.) Can one of you link the one where he says deep arms is better than deep prot for threat? I skimmed around quickly and couldn’t find it. Thanks.
Anyway, I think we’re talking about vastly different scenarios. I think he’s probably talking about speed clearing stuff as Arms or Fury while tanking with a 2hander or dual wielding and playing with 4 other pro players, including none other than Jesus Christ himself as your healer.
I’m talking about average Joe WoW player, running 5-mans while leveling, with an enhance shaman or feral druid healing, who probably doesn’t want to be healing but got pressured into it.
I’m talking about tanking with a shield, in defensive stance, to make things easier for your healer. In that scenario, I just don’t see arms beating prot in threat, given equal gear and skill…
Level 10-20… Okay maybe here Arms gets a temporary leg up in threat due to Anger Management, and being able to Charge and swap stances and keep the rage (when it is safe to do so). Prot gets +5% block, 1 rage per block, +10% armor, and Improved Shield Block.
Level 21-30… Arms gets Impale and Sweeping Strikes. Prot gets Defiance for +15% threat, Improved Sunder Armor, Improved Taunt, and Concussion Blow. I’d say this is where Prot pulls ahead. When you have about 5% crit, Impale is not that impactful.
Level 31-40… Arms get Axe or Sword Specialization and Mortal Strike. Prot gets +5 rage per Bloodrage, Last Stand, 1h Specialization (+10% to all damage), and Shield Slam. Huge advantage Prot, IMO.
A level 40 arms warrior is not going to do more threat than a level 40 prot warrior, assuming both are using a shield and primarily in defensive stance for the extra mitigation. And I don’t think it’s even close.
Also, switching to defensive stance is a tradeoff of -10% damage for 45% more threat with defiance (30% without defiance). So I seriously doubt your increased damage in Battle or Zerk Stance is going to compete with my +45% threat.
If you’re tanking in Battle or Zerk Stance without a shield, you’re not really a tank. You’re just another rogue in the group, and you’re 5-man basically has a 1 healer/4 dps setup, which can probably work in low level stuff if you have 5 great players, including a great healer. But most groups aren’t going to be able to pull that off unless they outlevel or outgear the instance, so I think it’s really bad advice to be spouting on forums for the learning/aspiring tank to read. Most leveling groups are going to want their tank in defensive stance using a shield.
You must unlearn your comforts.
it was totally wait for 3 sunders in vanilla, but yea, retail and the easy mode threat aoe threat changed made has made dps complete idiots.
I farmed dungeons with a warrior tank and a group of 3 mages from like 32 to level 57.
We have no aoe threat issues.
Pull like 5 packs in ZF and like 7 packs in BRD first room.
Maybe in like very veyr early levels a tank might lack aoe threat/taunt capabilities…
Also once our warrior tank spec’d fully tank dedicated, it was very noticeable difference.
I could see an argument to going prot at 40 for shield slam, but I’d still miss tactical mastery too much. Personally I’d wait till 50, but even then you should be able to tank everything short of dm and raids, as any of the three specs.
He has a great video (aimed at hard core raiders) about why you don’t need a shield to tank once u get the right gear lol. He speed clears naxx in a fury spec dual wielding, dude is a ridiculous good tank.
Yeah, I’m not saying everyone should level prot. I do it because I just like the sword and board style and durability, and I’m not in a race to get to 60. I’m more patient than most, and I like questing.
But I was just saying, if you DO spec prot while leveling, you WILL do more threat than arms or fury while tanking with a shield in defensive stance. The majority of the tree is dedicated to improving threat, after all.
As for tactical mastery, yeah I miss it, mainly for charging for extra initial rage. But the majority of the time in instances it’s better to los pull with ranged anyway. I plan on picking up tactical mastery and anger management at levels 45-51, on my way to a 14/5/32 build.
Just watched part of one of his videos where he goes through his specs. It’s certainly interesting, but his DW fury/prot spec is not going to work in 99% of guilds. It requires 40 ELITE players or it requires that everyone outgear the content or a combination of the two. It’s for super elite guilds pushing for speed clears, basically. Again, only useful for a small number of players in the world.
Kerg is using one of the deep prot builds main tanks use. Arms 31/20 or 31/5/15 are both off tank builds, the second more off-tanky than the first. Some people are of the opinion that main tank builds aren’t necessary but it’s really up to the individual 
Playing on a PvP server confuses things more because deep prot builds won’t save you against a rogue or mage, so it’s hard if you want to do any world pvp. And respect costs are … 0.0