I agree, but it’s still wild how they gave y’all a better version of karma
First ever dracthyr I seen in forum, respect
Well, we are called “retribution” paladins. So yeah 
we pretty much have a copyright on the “payback” fantasy.
At least karma damage doesn’t have a meteor effect nor can be kited away.
You mean having a 20 yard range, 6 second duration, and requires the target to be physically in front of you?
Or the dmg to be completely ignored by a random dispell?
Gotta maximize the boost and token income first.
You can port?
I dunno what to say lol. Different tool kits are different.
I can say that it’s wild that tiger’s lust is a much better version than steed since it actually removes snares and doesn’t need the help of another spell that’s on the gcd to fully function properly.
Tiger’s lust
Reapplies slow/root
Because that’s real helpful to stay on target and brawl right?
I didn’t say it grants immunity.
But steed needing to rely on freedom, which is in the gcd, feels bad. But it’s fine now since we got better range and steed is off the gcd.
And no but porting helps you survive too. Which is the main purpose of karma/sov. Paladins don’t have a port.
You cant compare sov and karma while completely ignoring the entire toolkit of both classes.
Sure you can.
Karma isn’t a CD, whereas 100% of the timey ou need to go through shield.
Ret also brings spellwarding, sac, bop, instant off heals, bubble, unhealable damage, one shot damage, the wrath of God himself, and slots into any team comp.
Oh I also forgot ret can do their entire rotation from range. Melee btw.
4 Likes
You mean the 1 min wall that can be used in stun that basically guarantees you have it every single burst set up?
Or the instant flash of light every 6 seconds that does 2-4 times the amount of healing as the 10 second instant heal monk can do?
Do not try and say the monk toolkit is anywhere comparable to current ret.
Well monks have better cc than ret, all of which is undispellable.
better mobility than ret both offensively and defensively.
comparable burst to ret.
So it seems to me you can either improve in self sustainability, sustained dps, and I guess group utility
Which 2 of the 3 would you prefer?
As a ret, this pretty much sums it all up.
Just stop man youre a bozo
3 Likes
Did I say something wrong?
WW does not have more cc than ret
You have a ranged stun, an aoe blind, you can even take rep
Monk has sweep and incap
2 Likes
No they both have about the same CC in the mathematical sense. Monk CC requires them to be out of position to where they typically want to be, while a ret doesn’t need to.
This is a BIG cap for the last 2 expacs.
Sure, but not tanky, so who cares?
I don’t think you ACTUALLY understand anything outside of your rotation that no one even understands to begin with
1 Like
What is your endgame here, precisely
leg sweep, para, and ring.
That’s 3 if my math still works.
Also para and sweep are all undispellable and have lower cds than hoj and blind…
So who’s the bozo?
Ret effectively auto-wins most non-mirrors and there’s still there’s Paladins going “um actually”
1 Like
Bulky comparing ret and ww. So listing the strengths and weaknesses to see what he think we can improve in by using ret as reference since he’s comparing the two