Oh I see your point, I do think there has to be compromise for the best all round solution, and I think waiting 10-15 mins (Which would only really happen for DPS and obscure dungeons) is a fair compromise, and tbh it’s not really a compromise at all as DPS are going to be waiting more than 15mins usually.
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I’d rather players just have the agency to turn it on or off themselves when they want. But I’d assume that everyone would just enable cross realm.
But in general, I support cross realm.
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Doesn’t really matter who was for or against it.
The matter of fact, it is in the game.
There is no more talk about server identity. It’s done. With PvP as is, you should not impose these “rules” to PvE. That’s just not fair.
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2 wrongs don’t make a right though, why go further down the rabbit hole? I’m not here to debate any of this in this thread anyway, I’m here to discuss a potential compromise. Which I think should involve some degree of cross server with the ability to get local server more often then not.
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I agree with the spirit of the idea.
I’ve been thinking a lot about the Dev’s notion of “Serendipitous Social Interactions” and, at least right now on a smaller server (2-3 servers above the cut line) those just don’t happen more than every few weeks - without RDF - which is part of why the grouping aspects of the game period are pretty thin for me personally, and why it might truly take cross-server RDF to keep me playing past phase 1.
So while I also agree with the notion the devs have in mind, I just don’t think they have a good grasp of how that plays out in practice across server types, both at the lower end and probably also the very high end.
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Yeah, and I can live with this suggested compromise.
As for the first part, it is not about 2 wrongs make it right, it is about making it equal.
Now, I don’t want to take it away from PvPers. It’s horrible. I hate taking away things from others. It’s not right. So PvE’rs should be given the same opportunity. RDF was that system that made PvP queue for Arena’s/BG’s and dungeons even.
Like, Horde on 95% horde realms complained how PvP was impossible.
But no one seems to give 2 
about those 5% alliance who struggle to put a 10m group together. Tell Alliance to xfer? Why not tell horde to xfer instead?
Do you see where this double standard comes from? All I want is equal opportunity.
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I think its fine.
Actually, as evidenced by discussions in the forums and on Reddit, a lot of people would turn it off once they hit Northrend. And probably prefer to have it off for levelling alts, but likely that wouldn’t get too many pops.
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The things you’ve listed do not exist in any meaningful way already. People in top guilds that interact with and compete with each other have “server identity”, so, maybe 3% of the server population. Server identity, accountability, recognizing other players does not occur for the other 97% of us. At all.
Blizzard’s new Elitism Finder is a cancer upon the game, desperately made by novice hubris devs that are looking for any excuse to get a paycheck for an 18 year old game that is already fully functional and ready to be shipped.
Zero tolerance. No compromise. Original dungeon finder ONLY, and these delusional three-percentists who think server identity is somehow a real thing despite their never leaving guild chat can touch grass.
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This might be true on the megaservers, but not every server has 10,000+ faces in a crowd. Also, this proposal is literally giving the best of both worlds for those who want it.
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Sure but it could be much better by letting people queue for all dungeons.
Yeah I can see your point there. These unbalanced servers have really got out of hand, but unfortunately unless blizz does something drastic, that ship has sailed.
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Haha this is perfect! We have cross realm BGs that are perfectly fine but cross realm dungeons? Oh NO!! People will still find a way to deflect this guaranteed. So many of the people who shoot down others ideas but when theirs get shot down it’s a whine fest.
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Cross-server is fine IMO.
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Yeah, not everyone is a PVP’er and those groups don’t really have an effect on community, because PVPers don’t really pay attention to each other, and PVP battlegrounds have always been queued, instead of using group forming outside the dungeon as the only method to access them.
Whereas people who are focused on PVE are far more community and team oriented, so the people who consider this important don’t want the community they care about to be damaged by cross realm.
Additionally, many people asked for removing cross-realm as well for Battlegrounds, but the overwhelming PVP player response was “We always had it, so we demand it”.
RDF is as if Blizzard said:
"We’re removing the ability to queue or enter without going to the entrance of the battleground."
Would you be looking for compromises if they said that? Or are you happy to hang around outside the battleground entrance in Arathi or Hillsbrad? That’s why RDF is different to Battlegrounds, but I’m sure you will “find a way to deflect this guaranteed”.
This sounds fine at first glance but I don’t think holds up to scrutiny. There are plenty of guilds and social groups built around pvp, and also a lot of guilds and social groups that do both pvp and pve. Likewise, there are anti-social or asocial pve players who don’t do much more than pug (or join a guild and are toxic, even worse).
Regardless, I think the bigger problem is the perspective is going to depend a bit on which server you’re on. On a larger server, there’s no real need for cross-server supply, and arguably at least some minor downside (though I think this is easily overstated).
On a small server though, raiding options are already incredibly thin, and even dungeon groups can be near impossible, esp off-peak. Without cross-server RDF I’m looking at either quitting entirely, re-rolling from scratch, or paying through the nose for Xfer. None of those are appealing since Wrath was the era I was most looking forward to, but I’m not sure I want to spend big on a cycle that might only last 12-15 months and where the destination server may well also tank at some point.
The two mid-pop servers I joined in classic that had healthy pops at the time are now becoming the bottom of the barrel post-consolidation.
If Blizz would resolve the server issue I would agree with you, but no cross-server RDF plus no meaningful server fix leaves a lot of players in a tough spot.
1 Like
Just because Blizzard closed most small servers doesn’t mean ‘mid-tier’ servers with a few thousand players are “bottom of the barrel”. Having every server be around 3-5k players would actually be the best situation.
Blizzard believes right now, that there are sufficient players on servers in order to get groups manually. Realm-Locked RDF does not decrease that group.
And we’re not getting cross-realm RDF, so it’s pretty much pointless to argue that it’s necessary.
Oh, I would generally agree with that. I imagine a server like Ashkandi is doing fine.
But there are at least 5 NA/OCE servers above the cutline that don’t have “a few thousand” players across both factions. (Earthfury = 150, Old Blanchy 617, then Azuresong, Bloodsail Buccaneers, and Myzrael all under 1400 total). Ashkandi’s smaller faction has more players logging than the total of both factions on those servers.
And while some don’t want to say those servers are dying bc it deters more players from joining (and even a few hundred new players might be enough to save a few of them), others have already indicated they’ll jump ship soon.
Yeah there are still small servers, and I agree that Blizzard needs to do some work to transfer the ‘superior faction’ off PVP servers. Things like offering free transfers off only to the dominant faction, and only allowing transfers in to the overwhelmed faction. Opening the door wide just gives the people who are being swamped an exit.