Raid vs Mythic+ loot tables

[Wirt-stalagg]

It might boring but its also the most powerful pvp stat because it reduces dmg taken.

[Jalen-emerald-dream (Jalën)]

From what I’ve understood though the bonus they’re adding to the 2 piece on trinkets isn’t granting that dmg reduction. I’m wondering if that’s because they didn’t want multiple games to head to dampening.

[Plasm-wyrmrest-accord]

Kaivax, the raid is absolutely popping with mastery leather and it’s effectively a dead stat for Vengeance Demon hunters, limiting its value for progression. Is there any chance you could ask about this topic? Vengeance has been struggling with itemization for a while now.

[Mcfluffins-proudmoore]

@Jalen-emerald-dream

@Mcfluffins-proudmoore

The only disadvantage you would be at is time to gear. The more content you do, the more gear you get. But this has always been the case since Vanilla. Not sure why this is a red flag after 16 years

Not sure what PvP game you’ve been playing but it certainly hasn’t been that way for 16 years straight. There was a time where you could only do PvP and never have to even glance at PvE.

Read my quote again. I was not talking about the quality of the gear. Merely pointing out that the more content you do, the more gear you get.

[Ajahs-wyrmrest-accord]

Meh, I see loot as becoming a tedium that people who have lives are no longer able to compete at basically any level. This is my concern.

I love all levels of challenges in this game, mythic, mythic+, raiding, but I just can’t wrap my head around having so few rewards for such a monumental amount of time spent clearing content. This is no longer vanilla, and it isn’t classic. It feels bad/punishing.

My concern is loot isn’t going to feel rewarding, it is going to feel like a really awful chore. And I mean in that case it is clearly no longer the game for me. Played since '04, but the game evolved for a reason.

[Shaldorning-bleeding-hollow]

@Raiimir-stormrage

What higher quality ? You’re not getting higher quality loot here. You’re getting less of the same loot you had in BfA.

You get more choice at the gear level that really matters. So you have a much higher chance at getting the piece of loot you want.

Without warforging (thank goodness that’s gone) M+ dungeon loot will be obsolete very fast.

[Seismos-malganis]

@Jalen-emerald-dream

If yes then there’s going to yet again be the problem of PvPers being forced into PvE content if they want to compete.

Unfortunately, unless there are PvP specific stats, bonuses, or incentives, this will always be the case.

[Elbardo-dalaran (Elbardo)]

I agree with what you’re saying and what the dev team plans for loot in shadowlands, but I would like to see more interesting loot. Most gear in the game now could be described as:

-primary stat
-stamina
-secondary stat #1
-secondary stat #2

And that gets boring really fast.

It would be cool if we saw more experimentation with extra effects on gear like it was tried in crucible of storms.

[Zhanli-wyrmrest-accord]

@Jalen-emerald-dream

I’m wondering if that’s because they didn’t want multiple games to head to dampening.

The dampening meta is up there with the worst things to happen to PVP, I don’t care what anyone says.

It’s right up there with the pruning and poorly implemented gearing system of Legion and beyond.

[Drakov-zuljin]

@Raiimir-stormrage

What was wrong with vendoring nonupgrades ?

I’d rather have fewer item drops that feel super good to get. I don’t get any satisfaction in vendoring fodder. It always feels super bad to get a non-upgraded drop from M+. If my BiS ring drops, I want to get my BiS ring, i dont want to worry about titanforging, i dont want to worry about sockets, i dont want to worry about tertiary stat, I just want that ring to be the ring, and when it drops, its good.

@Raiimir-stormrage

What higher quality ? You’re not getting higher quality loot here. You’re getting less of the same loot you had in BfA.

The chance of getting a dead weekly box is dramatically reduced, esp if you crossplay like I do. I know this season alone, in my first 5 weeks, I had 3 dead items. In SL, the chance of that being the case is dramatically reduced. The high tier items a player recieves are going to be the same quality, but there’s a much lower chance for them to be redundant or useless.

[Jalen-emerald-dream (Jalën)]

@Mcfluffins-proudmoore

Read my quote again. I was not talking about the quality of the gear. Merely pointing out that the more content you do, the more gear you get

Oh well of course you get more gear. But like I said my primary concern is having the ability to never look at PvE content and feel like I’m at a disadvantage because of that decision. Like the way things were for multiple expansions until Legion.

[Kyrshin-wyrmrest-accord]

Can you clarify what the default number of choices are in the Grand Vault?

Currently it looks like you can get to choose from up to 9 items if you no-life and do tons of content. Is that intentional?

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Shaldorning-bleeding-hollow

You get more choice at the gear level that really matters. So you have a much higher chance at getting the piece of loot you want.

Uh ? What extra choice ? It’s the same choices as BfA…

[Ajahs-wyrmrest-accord]

@Elbardo-dalaran

It would be cool if we saw more experimentation with extra effects on gear like it was tried in crucible of storms.

While I agree this is a lot of fun, think Diablo. I still speedclear GRs every single night for 2-3 hours, and some items, after so many many many years of play, are still not within my grasp because the right stat distributions simply have not dropped.

GRs (speed runs) take around 2-3 minutes each. Our M+s take around 30. MASSIVE difference.

[Zhanli-wyrmrest-accord]

Instead of being at the complete mercy of RNG in your weekly cache, you get to select the best from a pool.

That’s a huge improvement, you’re wrong.

[Shaldorning-bleeding-hollow]

@Elbardo-dalaran

I would like to see more interesting loot.

And that’s why legendaries exist. To make gear interesting. But having those effects on every single piece of gear would be too much.

[Jalen-emerald-dream (Jalën)]

@Zhanli-wyrmrest-accord

The dampening meta is up there with the worst things to happen to PVP, I don’t care what anyone says.

It’s right up there with the pruning and poorly implemented gearing system of Legion and beyond

Yeah. I honestly hate pillar humping games

[anon97449372]

@Mcfluffins-proudmoore

It’s only 3 item levels.

If it’s “no big deal,” then why the difference? How would you feel if M+ Rewards cap out three ilvls higher than heroic loot? Clearly there’s enough of an issue that the devs felt the need to say “no, it is the raiders that are most important.”

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Drakov-zuljin

I’d rather have fewer item drops that feel super good to get. I don’t get any satisfaction in vendoring fodder. It always feels super bad to get a non-upgraded drop from M+.

That’s not what you’re getting here though.

@Drakov-zuljin

The chance of getting a dead weekly box is dramatically reduced, esp if you crossplay like I do. I know this season alone, in my first 5 weeks, I had 3 dead items.

How are your chance reduced ? Will you really take the 213 Heroic raid loot piece because you dislike the 226s in the Mythic+ row ?

@Drakov-zuljin

The high tier items a player recieves are going to be the same quality, but there’s a much lower chance for them to be redundant or useless.

You keep using words like “dramatically” and “much”. You realise 3 items out of a loot tables of 80+ isn’t much different than 1 item out of 80+ ? That’s not a dramatic reduction.

[Areliu-proudmoore (Areliu)]

You’ve always been at a disadvantage, the best players do both.