Raid Rewards Experiments in Season 4

It has been confirmed by blue.

I think they had the vendor on the PTR - so you may be able to check on the WoWHead PTR site.

The answer is no, you cannot buy the bow with a Dinar.

That’s up to whether or not Blizzard decides to ignore the major player demographic of open world players.

Day 2 of asking: Will higher item level gear rewards be available from open world content in Season 4 of Shadowlands?

Every single time higher item level rewards became available with instanced content in Shadowlands (so far), BfA, and Legion, higher item level rewards were also made available from new open world content (a new zone or assault added), or previously available rewards (world quests) were scaled up.

In fact, the last time that higher item levels were made available for instanced content but not open world content was the release of Blackrock Foundry in WoD, and even that was only a minor item level increase (Blackrock Foundry was more of a delayed second half of a tier with Highmaul).

After seeing how the WoD design philosophy irreparably damaged server populations, guilds, and arguably even the game’s playerbase to some extent, are developers really going to be going through with a design decision that’s technically worse for the general player than what we saw in WoD?

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It also happened in vanilla, TBC, and Wrath but I guess that doesn’t fit the narrative.

Wrath classic is coming out in a few months and if you aren’t doing instance content you will be left in leveling greens and blues. Eventually 1-2 rep epics.

But growth did consistently occur during Wrath and peaked during Wrath. It would be a pretty hot take to say that Wrath was less popular or less acclaimed than BC.

TBC saw incredible growth because it was a bona fide expansion and took nothing away from the Vanilla content already there. A whole new world became available to explore and continue to level up in. New crafting materials and recipes were added. Two new highly popular races were added.

Wrath did this again, but was even more accessible.

Cata did not do this, as it was more of a WoW 2.0 than an expansion, and it was less accessible.

I raided and did dungeons casually in the original Vanilla, TBC, and Wrath when I had the opportunity. The community, and raid encounter design, is no longer the same, so today the more casual audience needs some kind of content with power progression.

The only “narrative” you can glean from this is that when people no longer have endgame content worth staying for, they buy the expansion but may not stay subbed and may not even buy the next expansion. Developers realized this and started offering more world content with gear rewards in Legion.

But Season 4 developers apparently don’t want to prioritize recovery from the player hemorrhage of Shadowlands, like how Legion developers aimed for recovery after the WoD hemorrhage.

Of f’ing course not. Glad I let my sub lapse. Recycled content and the same BS decision making that has destroyed this game.

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Didnt blizz state its only the fated raid that week (with increased ilvl + upgradable items) and the other raids will be as they are now (ilvl the same as they are now and items not being upgradable)? So week 2 would be ows/jathies > week 3 gavel?

Pretty sure they said that so you only have to clear 1 raid pw and not all of them.

While I appreciate finally having a vendor system for raid, it still falls short of addressing the enormous disparity between loot from keys vs. raid. This season +15s are easier than Heroic SFO, yet they offer gear on par with Mythic raid from the GV. Unless you’re toning down the GV rewards or making the +15s considerably more difficult, M+ will still outstrip heroic raiding as a path for gear.

The shards are just convoluted. Why not award valor for raid? Why do we need yet another currency??? Now there is pressure to cap both shards and valor, which is even worse than S3’s situation. Also, are the shards all the same so we can get a piece of Mythic raid gear after two Heroic full clears to build up 20 or do we have to beat our heads against Mythic to upgrade Heroic gear? If Heroic raid is truly a path to Mythic gear every couple weeks to parallel keys, it’s a step in the right direction. Unfortunately Mythic level gear from keys and valor upgrades will still be faster and easier to obtain. It would have been a lot better with a unified currency, a weekly cap, and both raid gear and gear from keys upgradeable with the same currency.

There will be 11 Great Vaults in the entirety of Season 4. That’s a substantial “toning down” of its relevance.

Because Valor is a reward intended for M+.

20 Heroic Shards → upgrade 1 LFR/Normal item to Heroic.

20 Mythic Shards → upgrade 1 LFR/Normal/Heroic item to Mythic.

Why would you think you would get 311 Gavel for killing Heroic Shriekwing? Lol.

Nah. What we’re getting is fine and lays a foundation towards what we’re getting in DF.

You can clear the fated raid on all 4 difficulties for shots at an item if you’re looking for it, and then you can upgrade it to Mythic. Granted, most people will not be farming Mythic Zovaal or Mythic Sylvanas, so its more like 3 shots instead hence my post.

Why not? You’re currently getting 278 gear in the GV for a +15 that is easier than pre-nerf heroic. It looks to me like you’re just trying to maintain the status quo because you play keys. As you point out, there are only 11 weeks in the season. Heroic raiders can only upgrade 5 pieces total on the shard system while you’ll have weekly valor upgrades AND access to a choice of 3 mythic level items in the GV.

If the heroic shards let you push normal/LFR gear to heroic once every 2 full clears, they’re a joke unless the heroic raids are quite a bit easier than SFO was at release of 9.2. By the time we were reliably killing KT to prog Sylvanas and Anduin to get farther into SFO we were sharding almost all the drops.

And I’m saying it should be unified. Heroic shards from heroic are a joke. If the system works as you stated (unclear) it just means we tuck heroic chest and weapon into the bank on the off chance we can cobble together enough mythic shards to upgrade a piece or two towards the end of the season. Our actual gear will still be from keys. At least with valor from raid, we’d have a reward we can actually use. Besides, WoW is starting to feel like a KMMO with all the currency bloat, and not in a good way.

12 weeks, but you will only have 11 vaults because when all is said in done the 12th Vault you get won’t matter once the season is over, as M+ gets loot at the end of the week rather than during it. Same difference I suppose.

A fully deterministic choice from any weapon or trinket is not a joke. That’s a 100% guaranteed Gavel, OWS, Veinripper, Edge of Night, Aegis, or any other completely bonkers OP-OP item that is still nutty from Heroic Ilvl. SoD has tons of bonkers loot if you’ve forgotten already. I’m literally wearing an Aegis from SoD RIGHT NOW, and most Warriors are still wearing OWS, and these items are only going to become even more powerful next patch.

Getting 311 gavel for killing Mythic Shriekwing, Mythic Terragrue, or Mythic Vigiliant is already pretty generous my dude. You’re kidding yourself if you think that the game would not devolve into literal “raid or die” if you were to pick up a 311 Gavel week 2/3 of the patch from just Heroic.

In DF, there will be a unified currency separate from Valor. Valor will still exist, but there will be a badge currency that comes in from M+, Raiding, and PvP that you can access to get specific crafted slots.

However, Valor is an M+ system. It is not a raid system. It is meant for M+.

I hope that the Fated system is going to be the foundation of better raid loot, because currently raid loot is kinda off eclipsed by M+ stuff, both in acquisition and longevity, especially if you try to gear with just raids.

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We know what we’re getting in DF. You’ll earn badges from the raid that you can use to “craft” (buy from a vendor) up to 5 items to fill slots for bad-luck protection.

Where did you find that information?

I’ve said the same thing. Why can’t we have just one universal upgrade currency that drops from all content? Blizz never seems to follow the KISS principle.


Blizz seems to be trying to find a balance that I’m not sure exists.

Either you design your game around performance/competition and make all the tools to participate highly accessible (if not outright available), or you design for farm/grind gameplay and the content becomes easier to allow people to casually romp around.

These systems they’re coming up with for ‘bad luck proctection’ are an acknowledgement that RNG can really bless some folks and completely destroy other’s experiences of the same game. It’s a lesson they should have learned in Legion with RNG legendaries.

The weird thing is they discovered the bad luck issues in Vanilla and gave us universal currency from dungeons and raids with vendors in TBC, WotLK, and Cata. It’s like they forgot and had to relearn it all over again.

It’s not really the same when back then dungeons had no fleshed out progression path. They were just badge factories.

And the badge gear always sucked compared to the raid gear.

That isn’t the case anymore. Dungeons are a standalone progression system and can gear with items on par with the hardest raids.

If you want to go back to buying 1 heroic equivalent item every 3 weeks from badges while removing mythic+ gearing entirely you can champion that, but I don’t think it’ll be popular.