PvP Gear Scaling: The Closest Thing To Balance We Had & Why It's Needed In SL

The below is from a forum post on wowhead about Monk’s taking off gear in arena and one-shotting players with Touch of Death (now very aptly named) and the problem with “behind the scenes” gear scaling.

"The main problem in BfA’s PvP is the “internal” and hidden scailling.

Other expansions like MoP and WoD had sucessful “external” scalling that weren’t complex to understand and did not have side effects like this.

The best competitive PvP system would be Legion’s Templates, but it limits player choice in stats.

The second best system - but the most interesting - would be MoP and WoD’s, because it allowed for a gearing process and made PvP gear the overall best one for PvP.

(OBS: PvP-only stats don’t fix this problem and are also hard to balance. Having PvP gear that could upscale in instanced PvP is a simple and better solution)."

I personally wasn’t a fan of Legion template: I felt it made gear irrelevant (largely). PvP gear scaling in PvP situations was amazing, like in previous expansions, and is a great idea. Here comes the raid-geared player thinking that the guy/girl sitting herbing is an easy target based on HP. Then once combat engages, the herbalist’s stats jump because they are in PvP gear.

I personally wish PvE gear would be PENALIZED in PvP: I hate Raiding and Mythics, yet it’s literally required for the best ilvl/time spent. What I mean by that is I love PvP but have like 5+ toons I enjoy playing: to remain competitive on just one, I must PvP all the time and even then I fall behind when I can just hop on and do one Mythic+ or a pug Raid and get better gear in that time than if I spend it grinding Arenas/RBGs. It’s silly not to be able to play what I want and excel in that area of the game (PvP vs PvE) after this game has been out for 15+ years.

PvE gear should only be boss in PvE.

  1. You have War Mode off: PvE ilvl applies in the open world at all times.
  2. You have War Mode on: PvE ilvl only applies when not in combat with other players, once engaged then you lose some percentage of stats. This would result in literally the largest QQ-fest ever from PvE players (even though they could just leave War Mode off), so I doubt this will happen.

Similarly, PvP gear should be best in PvP.

  1. You have War Mode off: PvP ilvl applies in the open world at all times.
  2. You have War Mode on: PvP ilvl only applies when not in combat with other players, once engaged then you gain stats at some percentage.

I would also like to clarify that I’m not screaming, “I PLAY ALTS, I WANT FREE BIS GEAR!” What I’m saying is that I should be able to PvP and get gear that is better for that gameplay than having to do PvE. Again, I’m talking time played/gear ratios. Gladiator Gear and Mythic Raiding gear will still be BIS and should be on par base ilvl: but given a Mythic Raid geared toon and a Gladiator geared toon, the latter SHOULD do better in PvP and the former SHOULD do better in PvE.

Maybe make the ilvl jump like 30ilvl: comparable PvP gear is 15ilvl lower than equivalent PvE gear. Thus a Gladiator geared toon in Mythic Raiding won’t do as well as a Mythic geared player because it’s 15ilvl behind, but if you stick a Mythic Raid geared character in PvP, the Gladiator will have a 15ilvl bonus.

I’m not saying it’s an easy fix, but I’m also not a game designer. If I can come up with the above off the top of my head, someone getting paid to do this should be able to run with the idea and make it work! Lmao. It wasn’t a perfect system when the aforementioned scaling existed, but it was on the right track. I really think what I outlined could work well at solving this imbalance, at least the concept if not the numbers (which I used as example).

3 Likes

They should just squash gear differences rather than scaling it, for the purposes of world mobs and PVP.

For example, say the baseline gear ilvl in BFA is 300. Gear ilvl continues to increase by 15 per raid difficulty level and 30 per tier in PVE instances. However, in the world and in instanced PVP, the ilvl above 300 would be worth 20% as much.

In this example, current Normal raid gear would still be ilvl 445 in instanced raids and M+, but would only be 329 in PVP and against world mobs. Mythic raid gear would be 475 in instances but 335 in PVP and the world. 35 ilvl over the baseline 300 would still be a substantial advantage, but the 6 ilvl between Normal and Mythic gear wouldn’t be insurmountable.

It could be open or hidden, but this kind of ilvl squashing would fix the “naked monk” problem because it wouldn’t be vulnerable to exploits the way gear scaling is. Hopefully they’ll be using something like this in Shadowlands.

The PVE gear versus PVP gear issue is a separate issue. If all gear was squashed like this for world and PVP content, the huge advantage from raid gear would be minimal and we wouldn’t need separate types of gear.

1 Like

This is it, easy to understand and made PvP gear BiS for PvP.

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As it is now, Raidboy cried so much on the forums, that now they get to be the most powerful PvPer’s in the game too.

I don’t want to raid for top gear. I like PvP, WPvP, and I want gear that keeps Raidboy horde from being able to stand in Stormwind going 1 vs 4 and winning, so that they can just walk around like it’s a horde capitol city, laughing at everyone. Is that too much to ask?

2 Likes

This is fun though. It’s better than, “I have more people than you, therefore I win.”

Trust me, I don’t like to raid or mythic+ for gear either, and it should definitely be changed to make PvP gear better and more accessible, but gear mattering is a good thing. No scaling, remove all of that.

this is stupid as a veteran player of 15 years i do not want to see people competing get gear then bg or get owned its how twinks were destroyed and it should be up to people to understand no gear i will die my fault not get carried free and clear im sick of seeing my crits fo 100k on a person with 90k hp and they lose 15% health its moronic

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Agree on the gear. My main point being that the Raidboy gets to have the top PvP experience instead of PvP players having gear to counter them.

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There should be too different sets. Pvp gear for the pvper and pve gear for the pveer. Like it was all the way up to legion.

3 Likes

PvP gear scaling from WoD, SOLID IDEA
Cryptic Uknowable PvP Scaling in BFA - BIG DOO DOO

2 Likes

Top level PvP gear should be fairly easy to get and experiment with. In PvP it should be between heroic and mythic raid ilvl but then should scale to LFR gear in PvE.

Gladiators will be able to get slightly better gear that scales to mythic level in PvP.

PvE effects should not work in PvP including trinkets but again PvP gear is not hard to get so if a PvE main wants to be competitive in PvP they have to do very little to earn the trinkets.

Done. I feel this would solve the entire issue.

Thoughts welcome.

Cheers!

I think the biggest issue is PVP for the most part doesn’t make blizzard money, because wpwp is useless in the way its been implemented . taking away pvp servers really put a nail in the coffin for the pvp game . sure you could say people buy tokens for pvp carries but why do that? for the title only? pve gear will beat your butt in the real world. Now if PVP gear was worth something then blizz would make cash on token sales and carries