http://www.strawpoll.me/20990829/r
Just for fun and get feedback. 
2 Likes
I waaaaanted to vote for option #3, but it comes with a caveat. I don’t actually mind that folks who do both aspects of the game having access to the absolute best stat allocations. This feels ok, provided that advantage remains reasonable (ie, small).
The caveat is that PvP only players should have accesss to a gearing path that makes them viable, and is also attainable at all skill levels. Gear isn’t what should make or break PvP performance, it’s skill. I get that it’s there, and that people want it there, but with rating restrictions it feels like Blizzard is headed straight back to TBC where it absolutely sucked to have 2200+ players tanking their rating (for lulz, wins, and/or carries) and fighting folks in the sub 1800 brackets. It made it extremely difficult for later players to get gear to be competitive.
As much as I don’t support the WoD system, at least everybody got there eventually. So all SL really needs is the removal of rating requirements on conquest gear (or at least dropping it down to 1600 across the board) and it’s something that I can live with.
If the huge worry is the whole senseless “welfare epix” argument all over again… ugh… get over it? Though I’d be willing to bet that the folks here pushing for PvP gear for PvP don’t really care if that PvP gear works in raids or M+.
2 Likes
We need PVP gear to be separated, so it will work. If it treads on the toes of PVE, the PVP players will get short changed.
3 Likes
I would be the first one to tell you that No PVP gear should not work in any raids or M+ but I also think PVE gear should not do good at PVP.
1 Like
Honestly, I just don’t care!
Folks keep trying to make parallels between PvP and PvE and they’re just not the same. Trying to pretend they are, and ram gearing methodologies that just don’t fit, has been a pointless waste of time over the last 13 ish years.
Gear and mechanics are central to the core of PvE. Skill and class balance are central to the core of PvP. Having a bit of overlap is fine, but trying to turn PvP into a PvE gear grind makes no sense. The only argument I’ve seen that makes any kind of sense is that people feel there needs to be a grind to entice people to participate in PvP. That may have been something that worked in the past, but after all this time the only folks who are going to PvP are the ones who are going to do it because it’s fun and they enjoy it.
Putting more effort into making PvP fun and less effort into making PvP look like PvE on paper would probably pay out way better for the health of the game.
So to bring things back… I don’t care if PvP works in raids on M+ and I don’t really care if PvE gear works in PvP. As long as people who only want to focus on one of those things have reasonable access to the gear that makes them viable in the thing they want to do, everybody should be happy and maybe not worry about everybody else.
5 Likes
It makes sense to the 3heads that need gear to win. That’s a factor that you’re missing. And they crave gear because PvP alone isn’t enough. They’re hamsters who need the dopamine rush of a new gear piece.
For me the ability to upgrade conquest gear without rating will make or break the expansion. If I’m stuck with 190 unranked gear, then there is no point. Mythic plus will again be a better gearing option for PvP outside of ranking.
I understand their sentiment that more difficult content should reward better gear, but PvP difficulty is not the same as PvE difficulty. PvP difficulty is a dynamic system where the difficulty is decided by the relative strength of other players. This practically means that, say, unranked BGs actually become more difficult as the time goes as more and more players get better gear outside of this content. So casual PvPers get gradually pushed put of their own content.
This is why old MoP and WoD system was better, because it just simplified everything, eliminated PvE aspect and gave common fixed power limit, which higher rated players could achieve quicker and concentrate on ranking, and casual players could work towards and still be satisfied.
edit: condensed the post a bit
5 Likes
It’s 1600. One six zero zero. Sixteen hundred. One thousand six hundred. You can easily get that within a single evening of faceroll queuing lmao.
Like wtf it’s pathetic seeing people cry about needing 1600 for good gear. My god.
For me, it’s not the 1600 rating I just do not care for arenas. I’m big into BG’s that’s where you’ll find me 99% of the time. With that being said If I have to get 1600 then I, will I’d rather do that than raids or mythic.
3 Likes
There’s rated Bgs. Those are even more fun than randoms imo.
I think we’ve talked about this before… I have not had a good experience in RBGs. I don’t have the time to commit to a full team and PuGs have been generally self-centered. Fun is not the priority, weekly cap is. Finally, the meta is a little too all-encompassing. In arenas, I can pretty much play whatever I want, even if it’s not meta, and all I gotta do is find a friend to play with me at whatever pace we want.
Still though, it’s been a while, so maybe it’s time to give it another go. Once I get through the initial expansion raid prep, I’ll be working on PvP alts. Maybe I’ll level one of my horde ones and you can bring me to your groups and show me the ropes 
My experience with RBGs has not been great you get somebody farting and thinking its funny. Mom or dad hollering in the background, babies crying Then you got the lead when things don’t go right, he starts hollering in the mic no, thank you I don’t want none of that.
Now with that being said as many friends I have on discord and the sixth family members that I have playing wow now. We can make a pretty good RBG group.
Highly unlikely that will be the case. The question is to what level can unrated gear be upgraded.
It shouldn’t be like that it should be the way it was in mop where it took you few more weeks to grind it out.
1 Like
Yes I understand people not liking arenas and that is okay. I used to dislike arenas myself and even still I am not a huge participant in it, but I am not going to say that people pushing more content shouldn’t be rewarded for doing so. My inability or my lack of desire to push that content should not prevent those people from earning their justified rewards.
I don’t necessarily agree that the reward should be higher ilvl gear, I think that doing it the way of allowing slightly quicker access to the same ilvl gear would be better. However, getting 1600 is such an extremely low bar that it’s laughable seeing people get upset over it.
This is the case in every game with a competitive mode. At this point it’s just phased out as background chatter, I don’t care if someone is raging. I can mute them if I want but usually I try to tilt them more so they burst a few blood vessels.
Unfortunately it’s something you have to go through if you don’t already have a team/group/guild. Ignore the ragers, add the cool ones on btag. Keeping weeding out the jerks. I don’t know why people struggle with ignoring a random stranger raging on the internet.
Depending on what I play, in 2s as double dps it’s pretty difficult to push past 1.6k actually. At least in my experience. Maybe I’m bad, very possible. I never really liked the arena gameplay I admit. My max was 1750 in 2s as double dps, and that was after a lot of games with the same partner.
All I want to say is that I want to be able to be adequately competitive in random BGs by just doing PvP. With some arenas and yolo RBGs inbetween. I don’t mind higher ranked players getting gear faster, or even stronger. I just worry that PvE will again be much more lucrative on low end of PvP.
3 Likes
That’s a you problem.
Then why did you just say:
How are you going to tell me that you want to be adequately competitive in BGs by just doing PvP when you just said that you want to be able to upgrade gear with no rating? You just want gear handed to you and you want heroic gear for little-to-no effort.
I don’t want any heroic gear man 
I just want to have a good gear to PvP with.
I get my heroic gear from heroic raids if I want to spend time on that.
1 Like
I only specified heroic gear because that’s the equivalent ilvl that rated gear at 1600 will be in Shadowlands.
You can have good gear to PvP with. Do a night of rated queues and you’re right up there with heroic raiders 
If that’s the case, then I’m happy We just don’t know yet