PvP Changes

[Bogardan-benediction]

i feel like adding tbc daily bg quest would be a good starting point
like adding a 10k honor quest off a specific bg win + 3 marks extra ontop of 3 rewarded by winning the bg itself

[Ashgaar-nightslayer]

@Drosul-nightslayer

1. Cut the honor from AV by half.
2. Add a “Solo queu random” button, with such a massive honor boost that it’s roughly equal to AV spam right now, regardless of getting wsg/ab/av

• Anyone who wants to premade can still premade.
• Anyone who doesn’t want to premade can queu solo random without a massive honor/hour loss
• Fewer people are likely to premade in general since solo queu would provide the same honor/hour with less hassle… So less crying about premades.
• Since the queu puts you into any of wsg/ab/av, the bgs are all actually populated.

This i agree, specially since its largely just changes in values, so easy/cheap to implement.

@Drosul-nightslayer

• Fix every terrain exploit in wsg, including gy side wall climbs, tunnel jumps, and fence jumps. Also remove the “mid- top of tunnel” level (ie you could be on the very top of tunnel, but not that mid level).
• homogenize the shape of the tunnel buildings (horde’s is slanted and easier to fall off of, while alliance’s is really secure footing) and also homogenize the fences (horde’s can be jumped over, alliance’s is tall)… (Idea here is that you can still run around the fence, but never jump through or over it, for either side)
• DR on entrapment so roofing via banana isn’t the pure cancer it is right now, if there’s even one dispeller with the hunter to get rid of faps.
• Paladin and shaman for both factions
• Mixed faction player pools (prevents faction stacking)
• Paladin’s judgement of justice gains TBC functionality (where it’s not a snare, but no movement speed beyond 100%)

This is very likely beyond that scope of Classic and most of it gets fixed in TBC.

And as a funny anecdote for WSG’s map fixes, they’ll never happen, i was told so directly by the game director as it was one of my question for him when they did QA streams and his answer was basically “we’ll just make other maps instead”, or something along these lines.

Like i didn’t talk to him myself but they had made a thread “post your PvP questions here” and they picked it up.

That was years ago, i think for the release of Legion, but kinda doubt their stance changed as i’m fairly sure WSG’s map is still borked on retail to this day.

[Steeldust-nightslayer]

I would accuse you of stealing my idea, but it is just common sense. The way SoD does the Ashenvale PVP event (apparently) is how Alterac Valley should have worked from day one.

AV has been a miserable BG since they started removing stuff way back in Vanilla. The concept of the full game with a need to capture resources, upgrade units and take objectives belongs in an MMO based on the Warcraft universe.

This change won’t happen, let’s be honest. We are playing an anniversary version of a game that is the way it is. It would at best be implemented in the next seasonal version of WoW - and that would be cool.

WSG needs the retail version of it to be playable. As-is you make a gamble every time you queue that your time will be wasted and honor gains will be slim to none. That’s why nobody is playing it. AB is better and very fun, but the honor per hour isn’t there. Sadly these two BGs are for when you don’t need anything and just want to BG for fun in their current state.

Another thing they could do is bring in the concept of the “Random Battleground” that awards a decent amount of honor just for queueing it and playing whatever you get and healthy bonus honor for a win - but you gotta stay until the game ends. If the honor had the right values that could make spamming a random BG queue the best honor per hour without changing anything about the Battlegrounds themselves. It seems more feasible to do in Classic Anniversary since it requires the least amount of change.

[Ashgaar-nightslayer]

@Steeldust-nightslayer

AV has been a miserable BG since they started removing stuff way back in Vanilla. The concept of the full game with a need to capture resources, upgrade units and take objectives belongs in an MMO based on the Warcraft universe

Yeah the fact a change they made in like 2005? (idk i wasn’t around) is stil hurting thegame now is wild.

I still think the best “mass/siege pvp” map they ever did is Wintergrasp. It had issues but the fact it wasn’t spammable probably helped a ton. People just saw it as a bonus boost in honor, not something they needed optimize the fun out of for maximum returns.

Its what they should had done with AV from the start, make it an event.

[Nyhver-whitemane]

I think they did buff AV npcs and make it harder to blitz man.

Maybe it was just SOD

idk game engine is cooked

[Yeetcannon-nightslayer]

@Lorithas-nightslayer

The problem with making changes to AV is that AV is the only BG people play and the majority of people are such complete slaves to the meta that if you made changes to AV that didnt still boil down to RIDE NORTH/SOUTH AND WIN OR LOSE INSIDE 6 MINUTES DO NOT EVEN LOOK AT THE OPPOSING FACTION THIS IS A BRD SPEEDRUN the number of people queueing it would collapse overnight.

I disagree. I think it would boost engagement.

@Lorithas-nightslayer

arena

agree… Arena is not for vanilla… fine in TBC onwards.

@Steeldust-nightslayer

Another thing they could do is bring in the concept of the “Random Battleground” that awards a decent amount of honor just for queueing it and playing whatever you get and healthy bonus honor for a win - but you gotta stay until the game ends. If the honor had the right values that could make spamming a random BG queue the best honor per hour without changing anything about the Battlegrounds themselves. It seems more feasible to do in Classic Anniversary since it requires the least amount of change.

This would be dope!!!

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Not trying to necro, i just forgot i posted this lol…

Anyways, AV needs changes to be like SoD’s Ashenvale PvP event was… Make end bosses unkillable til warmasters are dead. Make warmasters super strong and tanky so it requires the actual group to kill them. Make actually controlling the domination points on the map matter (maybe make them give significantly more honor when theyre captured and destroyed?).

This gets people to play the game as it was designed, just like the olden days. The problem with a 20 year old game is that players have found the path of least resistance, and now instead of playing the game they choose to play the game and take all of the fun out of it.