PvP Ask for New Chaosbringer Talent

Continuing the discussion from Guardians of the Dream PTR Development Notes:

Hello! Firstly, I think this is a great design direction, but there are two PvP considerations I worry about in regards to Chaosbringer and losing Madness of the Azj’Aqir:

  1. Chaos Bolt no longer buffs future Chaos Bolts by 25%. However, with the 15% baseline buff to Chaos Bolt and 15% additional damage from 2 points in the Chaosbringer talent, this is technically offset… so should be fine.
  2. Madness of the Azj’Aqir, as we all know, reduced Chaos Bolt cast time by 20% when chaining several in a row. While the damage of Chaos Bolt will still be present, lining up several in a row was the big threat of Destro in PvP and just got 20% more difficult (roughly).
  3. Chaosbringer should ideally also reduce the cast time of Chaos Bolt by 10/20% to offset losing Madness of the Azj’Aqir, at least in PvP. Or, to be more balanced, 7.5/15% since such an effect is now static and not temporary.

I, as all Destro players do, appreciate that Blizz understands losing the Madness of the Azj’Aqir buff (and similar effects) due to necessary movement/CC and knockbacks was very penalizing and that this is a good step forward. I do not think these changes will nerf Destro in PvE at all, which is fantastic, it is only in PvP that the cast time increase will be problematic.

Hopefully there is an additional buff/change to Chaosbringer to compensate for this scenario in PvP. Perhaps this is another situation where there needs to be a PvP-only functionality applied to a talent! Similar to how Avenger’s Shield silences the targets in PvE but not in PvP (unless talented), Chaosbringer could increase the damage as outlined now but also reduce the cast time of Chaos Bolt only in PvP.

I’m just thinking on my feet here, but again, looking forward to these sort of changes that allow casters (particularly hard-cast specs) some movement flexibility! :heart:

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What about Demo? It’s not like we can walk and cast demon bolt or anything, oh wait nvm

Why are they even removing madness? It was a fun talent that helped make destro even less of a borefest that it currently is


I concur. The cast time reduction on Chaos Bolt is really what makes Madness so enjoyable to me. Removing that that quick burst of “BAM” will make the spec feel less fun unless the damage is increased enough to compensate for the satisfaction of playing around your shards, positioning, and conscientiousness.


The reasoning behind removing Madness is that if you need to move because of a boss mechanic, you may lose the buff, which can severely impact your DPS. That being said, the major problem with Madness is PvP.

If you are familiar with that gameplay, being crown controlled in any fashion (which there is multitude of in the current game) will most likely cause you to lose Madness while trying to burst. I have no problem if the baseline damage of Chaos Bolt goes up to compensate for losing this buff, which Blizzard has done, but removing the cast time reduction is brutal for PvP.

Thus, in some fashion, there needs to be a reduction in Chaos Bolt’s cast time for PvP. I am sure there are many ways to implement this, but it seems that having Chaosbringer simply apply this effect only in PvP would be the most ideal situation.

they didn’t need to remove madness, they just needed to increase the buff duration slightly to compensate for boss mechanics/pvp

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well! Chaos Bolt is officially dead in PVP outside coil and you only get one per coil GJ blitz, the good part here is that our new teir set is absurdly good in PVP and trashy as hell in PVE, so you won’t need to chain so many bolts when all your dmgs would be rift

it would be awesome if the devs reduced CB time to 0.5 fix shadowflame cone radius and also added a root or a knockback to it but hey, they are busy doing the 300000000000 sp and boomkin rework so the best they will give us its some number tunning!

100% this. Also, just move the Summon talents and GWD to the Class tree while we’re at it. @_@