Priest Heals Useless Vs Spiteful

Priests used to have Shining Force, which was one of the best spells in their kit, which basically meant you could manage Spiteful and actually heal when it’s needed. Now what do we have vs Spiteful ghosts? We have Psychic Scream, Feather, MC and Void Tendrils. Psychic Scream is not bad, but on a relatively long CD, you have to get up close for it to work and you get dps damaging the ghosts and then you are toast because it frees them up. Feather is kind of suicide for the group because you have to pretty much backtrack, which puts you out of range of healing. Void Tendrils must be the biggest joke in the game ever. It is pretty useless and has not helped me one iota in any run most of the time. MC might be good but honestly, by the time you cast it, that dps in trouble is dead and the ghost has hit you in the face and you are dead.

Honestly, I have been chased by so many ghosts this week, bricking keys occasionally even, here and there. I mean nobody really helps you except the off group that actually nukes them all or at least the ones chasing you down, or an occasional mage has the sense to realize that freezing them in place will allow you to heal not only them, but the tank on the brink, preventing a wipe. You might also get a monk who occasionally helps with a Ring of Peace once in a blue moon if they remember, but other than that? And even still, depending on others is not good policy in Wow. Or that is my experience, anyhow.

Honestly, I feel like you are already squishy as anything, which vs Holy Paladin is a real downer and joke at the same time. You can’t stun them or bubble immune them like you can as an H pally either, effectively negating the affix.

I dunno but I feel like there is something I’m missing. Other group members seem to have no idea of the threat they pose to you and rarely lift a finger, often charging into the next pack with no healer, and then group members dying.

I dunno. Is it just me?

Got a frost mage in your group. Nova, move on

Im personally coming to the conclusion i want the dungeon healing complexity that we have had but only fort/tyr affixs and make a seasonal. The others are just plain annoying.

You also don’t need to stand in melee. If you’re ranged and dying to spitefuls it’s a positioning problem on your part.

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You can dominate mind your ghost effectively turning it into a pet.

I usually try to position myself for the next pack and run with the tank. If there is an issue where I have to run through one I scream as I go and just keep moving.

Being a ranged healer helps a ton. I imagine monks and pallys have a harder time of it.

I think I have only really ever had a problem when the tank doesn’t move on and it is just silly dodging.

I have occasionally MC’d some but it just seems to take so long to cast I usually don’t bother with it.

Yeah, but the cast is slow. Ha ha! I do that but sometimes by the time the cast is off the ghost is almost dead, as are you being meleed just once or twice.

I thought or at least heard chatter that Holy Paladins could heal as ranged now; not that I would play one that way. As for Disc priests, you can’t Holy Nova spam unless you are in melee. And there are a lot of factors determining how easy it is to dodge–such as the size of the pulls–noting that some tanks in some instances are not thinking things through and the mobs are getting melted in big packs. That in itself is a good thing, but when you get a dozen ghosts spawning on top of tanks and melee, that is a HUGE problem. Also having only a small area to move in, as at Neltharus and Uldaman, Legacy of Tyr, and where tanks are pulling the mobs into niches so as to LOS, but where if you dont get in there to heal or dispel, expect trouble–as in deaths.

Yeah, I do as well, but some tanks do not know where you are as they are not paying attention and you can get clobbered–for example by frontals, such as at NL.

The thing is, yeah, you can be at ranged. Then the ghosts start heading for you as the rest of the group is moving to the next pack and a ghost is running at you–forcing you back or forcing you to MC. But either way, the group is out of range of heals, and if you play disc, you know that you then dont have the time to prepare for healing–as in dotting everything up and applying your atonements and then doing DPS as the big damage is coming in. You can, sometimes frequently be more or less arriving in range for healing when the others are at half health, putting you behind the curve–and with the one dps on the verge, you are forced to deal with that problem first, as the others are dropping in health.

Of course, in the end, in some cases none of the things are that bad for various reasons, but in other groups, where you get the usual tank not paying attention, the dps missing kicks, etc etc–this affix can be a real problem. Some dungeons are much easier with very wide open areas, such as at FH, which can make dodging them or moving away while still staying with the group easy.

In my experience, Shining Force was amazing for this affix. I am sad it is gone.

Between Tendrils, Scream and MC as well as being a ranged class, I honestly have had 0 problems with spiteful.

I have a way worse time on my monk or pally with spiteful specifically - but even for them it’s not really a rough affix. The only annoying bit is it keeping you in combat when you need to do something or want to drink as the group’s moving. But mana’s in such a surplus nowadays that rarely happens too.

I am not cool. I only started playing with this spell a little bit at the end of shadowlands. I think I tried it on sanguine weeks but man it launched mobs far!!! I imagine I needed to practice with positioning so as to not yeet mobs into other mobs or whatever but yea.

I personally don’t miss it only because I never relied on it. I certainly recognize it’s potential though.

I feel like this is part of a bigger issue: that the current model that all affixes are negative is bad. With all M+ affixes being negative, it frames M+ affixes primarily as a negative experience. It also places a disproportionate burden on the healer.

M+ should have at least one fewer negative affix and at least one positive affix where you have an opportunity to get some kind of bonus that speeds the run along, whether it be for throughput, movement speed, “count” (%), and so forth. And no stupid backlash effect like Season One where if you if you don’t clear it in time you are stunned for ~6 seconds!

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I agree. I miss positive affixes. I wish that the seasonal was aimed that way. Not like thundering “positive,” affix, but like shrouded or encrypted.

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I healed about 40 dungeons with this affix last week, hated it, but came to a few conclusions worth note. My main takeaway was certain dungeons are WAY better than others for this affix.

Halls is generally good, NL is good, VP is good, Ulda is not bad (or bad), depending. The reasoning for this is these dungeons typically have fewer big packs and typically (but not always) you have fair, if not a lot of room to dodge without the risk of pulling other packs (like at BH, which is crazy bad for this). Consider FH and BH. These dungeons are especially bad for this–as a lot of packs are big (and you often lack any room to go this way or that without face pulling). And in these cases when the key is not especially high and the dps are melting the mobs fast, expect a lot of trouble.

My second takeaway was that group members that can freeze the mobs in place or otherwise keep them from floating at you can really help a lot.

As for priest utility vs these mobs–I find it can help and save you but it generally royally bites. MC is good in a pickle, but it has a relatively long cast. Void Tendrils has a pretty long CD. Psychic Scream means you have to get pretty up close, and if your team breaks it you are in trouble. Versus Shining Force, all three of these abilities are a relative joke. I personally found Shining Force to be especially potent once you got it down, that is, to nearly completely nullify any problems with this affix.

Another takeaway was your big damaging Holy Nova spams–which can pump incredibly high damage done right–are not something you can do much with this affix either. That is, unless you like losing half or all of your health right fast.

I pretty much stopped reading here. The question any logical sane person would ask is. WHY. Im on oceanic, have kids job gym etc so i dont do anymore then 8 dungeons a week. I get respectable scores. 40 dungeons a week i would be 3k.

Unless you have a team and are pushing score, why put yourself through that. Im over 2700 and did 3 dungeons last week. This week i will do 1 and then dip into ptr to look at the new specs.

My advice is hit the gym bro :stuck_out_tongue: Get out of the game. You have too much time on your hands.

having said all that.

We arent getting it back. Let it go. they are cancelling our utility as it is. I doubt they give any back

Which got nerfed, so while useful will be less effective in next season?

Told you this already

Ult penance on spiteful would be fun have to admit, tho a waste.

I work out every day for 2-3 hours, ha ha. And I still managed all those keys last week. I am on track for the same this week. And outside of working out and Wow, I do little else but eat, sleep, bike ride, jog and walk. Well, and my wife and I go shopping together. Well, and not including other stuff like Netflix, Disney+, real life stuff, etc etc…

Don’t worry, I have it all mapped out to maximize my time in game. And I pug everything or 90% of my runs on FIVE priests. Why eight runs a priest?! That gets me three options in the vault every week for each of my priests.

The thing is, I have a ton of experience, but it does not show on my io. So essentially nobody knows I do that many keys. My main does not get easy invites as I do not play meta, Holy Paladin. And because I have so many runs to do I do not have time to wait around for the good invites that come few and far between.

[quote=“Dumblédroid-moon-guard, post:13, topic:1676364”]
Well, and my wife and I go shopping together.
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Im very very sorry. My commiserations to you.

I had to give up mythic raiding and amount of keys for work. With work settling down ive joined a mythic guild again and will do more keys but 40 is excessive bro :slight_smile:

I dunno. I don’t raid–which typically takes a while and means you have to put up with a lot of BS. I do a run, which typically takes half an hour or so. Then I log and stretch, workout, read, whatever. And I come back whenever. Yesterday, I did a total of about ten runs, was still able to workout for about three hours, go shopping, watch a couple episodes of Star Wars shows on Disney+, etc., you name it.

I work too, but from home. And I work for myself, having spent years learning about how to do so reading tons. Sometimes I am busy, other times not.

I think the first couple of weeks of the season I might have ran that many because I was pushing score along with running with my husband and guildies who are more lax.

I felt like the first worst mom.

We all have to find the balance that suits our family.

I am kind of jealous of the 2-3 hour work outs you are able to squeeze in. I can’t imagine finding time in the day for that! :clap:

I am more scratching my head at you having 5 priests! Why not 6? Or 4?

I think the monk I just leveled is my 6th 70 character. No plans on filling vaults though lol.

Actually, I have another on the way, but have to level her. Why? To cover all or most of the important professions. And why not just enlist the help of others? Who likes depending on others? What if they are not online? What if you just don’t dig what might be bugging others? It’s the feeling of independence that I love. Probably a me thing.

Was just thinking about this getting three declines in a row for a 20. I have healed 28 timed over 20 and still get declines nonstop. People are silly thinking a 447 priest with full sockets (actually full next week, but close enough) and having healed 28 20+ and 75 15+ keys (not to mention a few hundred more timed on my other priests–which they dont know about though) is not up to healing a 20. Late in SL when Holy Priest was meta, I got insta invites to 20s and all the way up to 25s and even when my experience was lacking. So weird people thinking a 20 is a 30 and you really really need meta and ONLY META for a 20, lol.

What i would say to that is while disc is semi close to meta, the common perception out there is most people suck at disc. So while disc is played at a high lvl those who play at a lower lvl ae bad. (perception i feel and ive had that commented to me by people inviting me to groups)

Which is why people get declined at lower lvls outside of a set group. Im willing to bet all ( well almost all) those disc playing at 25 key lvl have set groups.

Im also willing to bet that the number of disc doing it is or would be half to a quatre of the holy priests that would do it in a similar situation.

disc can be meta all it wants, you just wont see 75000 of them with logs but you might see that many holy priests.

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Yeah, makes sense. But I think disc needs group cooperation to pull off with ease. Like you have probably experienced group members who are always out of range of radiance, and they kill your HPS and even sometimes require you to constantly reposition yourself. And like when you put up a barrier–people who are not in it have to move into it. Also, I dont think people realize that disc HPS does not really fully reflect what a disc priest is doing. As in, Disc also has damage reduction spells that do not show on meters. So while, yeah, I fully agree, the “perception” is a huge part of the problem; people don’t realize disc requires group cooperation and it requires understanding of the spells–as in sometimes off healing helps a ton, sometimes using defensives is important, etc etc. Oh, and of course in lower keys, like 10-20, people dont really have to know. But I would also add that a lot of people dont understand the limitations of disc as well–and the trade off. That is, disc does pretty great damage played well–probably more than most other healer classes–at least currently–and I think currently it is actually the top damaging of all the healers. But people dont realize disc is pretty weak for its single target healing, outside of Dark Reprimand, that is (which has a significant CD). Like take the first boss at BH (the three boss fight, that is) and the third boss at Uldaman. Those bleeds from the bosses are pretty tough for a disc priest to manage in 20s and higher (on tyrannical weeks)–and people who can manage it with ease (like a mage casting Ice Block) often don’t. I have also struggled with the bleeds on lower keys on alts. The guides make plain that people simply ought to use health pots, but people dont care and/or expect miracles from the healers–and disc is pretty weak on these fights if people expect pure healing to carry the group. Like really, people dont want to bother with a healing pot? They literally sell for as low as one gold on the AH.

As for Holy Priests, I dunno. A lot play them but they are ranked really low of the healers. Their damage is also not very good, typically. But I dont speak from first hand experience. That said, I have looked at some logs and seen Holy damage (at least as far as what I saw goes) can be abyssmal (though I know some do pump great damage). The problem with the damage is not what it can do–but holy healing and damage are generally mutually exclusive, not like with disc.

The issue specifically with people new to the spec is not realizing how atonement works, and only try to heal using flash heal/radiance/shields which you can absolutely get away with at lower key levels. I grouped with a new disc in a 12 key, who did 5.5k dps overall at 444 ilvl. That screams to me not understanding how the class works and just trying it for fun. That one is an outlier, but if you look at a less experienced disc priest a majority of their healing is coming from radiance (this season especially with the tier set), which obviously is a horrible habit to fall into solely relying on radiance. I know my breakdowns are generally in the 55-65% of my healing coming from atonement, then everything else (and this is in 20+ keys, so it’s not like their is no damage coming out). Generally the damage is low as well for the newer discs, which will also result in lower atonement healing as a result. If we don’t get a talent to give us instant radiance procs I could see a lot of these people trying disc disappear immediately once they can’t rely on radiance to carry the way.

As for holy priest damage, I agree that is something that comes with experience. Learning when you can weave in damage while keeping the group alive. I know when I was practicing for break the meta I can usually get up to around 30-35kish dps overall with suboptimal play. I usually just blast the highest health target w/ empyreal blaze holy fires and let burning vehemence carry me to victory, while weaving in holy nova and halo. With a lot of healing downtime i’ll just be a smite spam bot inbetween holy fire casts.

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