Based Ythisens, thank you for shutting down all of this nonsense within a single thread.
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I thought I was the only one who noticed this. He does seem to respond frequently to random posts with trollish comments. Whenever I see a âblue postâ icon on a pointless thread I expect to see one of his trolls. Iâm guessing either the company looks the other way or doesnât know.
If youâre allowing people to carry over their rewards earned in classic to retail, I believe that wouldnât negatively impact classic. You arenât adding things that did not exist in Classic to the game, youâre giving an added incentive/benefit to play Classic. Put down the pitchforks for a second, and let me elaborateâŚ
The fact is, this has never been done with WoW before, and no one can know for sure how going one way or the other will impact Classicâs player base, we can only express our opinions and try to give informed reasoning why we feel that way, so let me address some of the concerns/ give my opinion on certain points:
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Two-way reward crossover (i.e. things you have on your account in retail that youâd like to be available to use in Classic). I personally think that this should NOT be allowed, as anything that was not available in Classic should stay out of Classic.
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Allowing the acquisition of old achievements/FoS/mounts in Classic to be shown on Retail will âdiminishâ or âlessen the valueâ of these same rewards already owned by those on retail. I donât agree with this, but I understand where itâs coming from. The same amount of effort (gameplay/mechanics/in-game) is expected to be required to obtain these rewards in upcoming Classic, the difference being: the player base available to coordinate and achieve these things will be competing with the player base on retail. So, unlike the times when classic was the sole official âWoWâ option, you now have people who are making the conscious decision to NOT play on live in order to spend (a lot of) time on Classic. If you support Classic WoW, why wouldnât you want to reward that decision/time spent?
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"But if they only play on Classic for rewards on retail, they arenât REALLY the people we want on Classic!" Are there not people who played in vanilla solely for the rewards, and didnât play (as much) after achieving what they wanted? If it means more people will be on the Classic servers, for however long they decide to be on them (more on this in my below point regarding TLP servers), isnât that better than people who would spend zero time on Classic? The âprestigeâ associated with these rewards, seems more to be associated with the fact that it was obtained many years ago, as opposed to the fact that it has been obtained, and this is already handled automatically by the datetime stamp on achievements, which many people use everyday to assign âvalueâ to an achievement (i.e. when a mythic boss was killed). Similarly, as mentioned in a lot of the replies on this topic, plenty of people took advantage of new retail servers opening long after a patch content was relevant or difficult in order to transfer and get the âserver firstâ achievements/rewards. I fail to see how thatâs NOT worse or âless valueâ than what people are worried about with Classic RELEVANT rewards, obtained appropriately, being accessible in Retail.
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Classic WoW should be itâs own separate game, with no crossover whatsoever to Retail (with the exception of access via a subscription). Anything else will ruin Classic. WoW was never meant to be a game that was frozen in time, with no future updates or content to look forward to. Classic is an homage, and as mentioned above, it isnât something that has been done before officially by Blizzard. There were/are a lot of emulated Classic servers that people played on âindefinitelyâ, but there were constant attempts to improve and/or capture the Classic feel by different groups who organized these servers. Additionally, most of these did not require a server subscription. If what the âclassic puristsâ are saying is true, (and I understand it correctly) they want a game that is frozen in a nostalgic age of wow that they can enjoy forever, without a worry of updates/changes to the game, or the servers becoming unsustainable and losing their progress because itâs not an official release. I think thatâs fine and I think itâs amazing that Blizzard is catering to that, but I also think there wonât be a large majority of potential Classic players out there that are willing to pay a $15/mo sub âjust for Classicâ and play it for an extended period of time, UNLESS they are also Retail players and benefit from access to the live servers as well. Which, if you can follow my logic there, why not give them an added incentive to spend time on Classic? Playing devilâs advocate and agreeing with point #4 I made at the beginning of this section, Iâd offer then that the best available option would be to leave Classic completely isolated on SOME servers (i.e. frozen in 1.12), and also open TLP (time-locked progression) versions of the classic servers, albeit likely in the future. These servers would be regarded as a hybrid between Classic and retail, and more akin to a new server launching (mentioned above with the people who xfer to a new server and back for achievements), than an isolated, preserved server for Classic. I wonât go into detail on TLP here, but enough AAA MMOs have done it successfully that there is obviously value to be seen in the time and effort associated. I understand itâs an exponentially bigger undertaking than a solely Classic server, but according to the hardships described when attempting to create Classic, as the content patches/expansions are less and less dated, it should be easier (than Classic) to recover and work with. Obviously all of the benefits of a Classic server can be said for TLP server as well, but multiplicative-ly, as one could experience any moment in WoWâs history from Classic to live, as a given TLP server progresses through WoWâs expansions. In regards to the rewards on retail issue, I think this would be the best way to keep the most people happy, though it is the most difficult to implement.
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Could also mean that Blizz thinks not everyone who accuses their CMs of being trolls is actually right to do so.
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Once again. Please stop pretending to care about the long term health or philosophical purpose of Classic when all you want are some cosmetics.
The reward is playing the game.
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You donât get to speak for everyone on what the ârewardâ is.
No, but Ythisens does.
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Blizzard said time and time again for years that Vanilla realms werenât happening. So you can see how the community doesnât put much weight in a statement from a Blizzard CM stating thereâs currently no plans. The community knows that with enough persistence, Blizzard will change their mind because Blizzard is in it to seek your dollar, not your gaming experience.
Somehow I missed that post, but thankfully once again we see Blizzardâs true commitment as to why Classic is being made, and for whom.
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Mdd â Ys has literally said
âthe point of classic is playing classic. If you dont want that, go play retailâ
THE LITERAL REWARD OF CLASSIC IS PLAYING CLASSIC FOR WHAT CLASSIC IS
and has been stated multiple times.
at blizzcon during the reveal.
During the classic panel.
Dozens if not HUNDREDS of times here in these particular forums.
How about the Devs? Hm? The ones that can be directly quoted as classic is its own reward?
you want collections, transmogs, and other crap? Play retail son.
You want the PLAYSTYLE the balance and the fact that everything IS NOT a damn âhighest gear ever wins. newbsâ
I played and PvPâd in blues for the LONGEST time in vanilla. I had 0 issues. Even at R11 VS full epic warlords and the like. BECAUSE IT WAS ABOUT SKILL. Not about your âZOMG MY WEAPON TITANFORGED TO 390 AND NOW I DO MORE DPS THAN EVERYBODY LOLOLOLOLOLâ vs "I practiced for hours in my gear to be able to fight and kick your a** MR. HWL and guess what?! BOOOOOOOOM dead.
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Help me out here. Is this:
- A reason to listen to current Modern players, who give Blizzard their dollars for something other than Classic whether they play Classic or not.
or - A reason to listen to players who only play Classic, who will give Blizzard their dollars if and only if they find Classic to be something they want to play.
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That was due to the mentality that âWoW should only go forwards and not backwardsâ
in the last couple years with WOD and Legion and BFA theyâve seen a huge drop in players but a HUUUUUUUGE increase in populations on private servers and more and more people saying âplease. Give us vanilla backâ
It was their philosophy that pushed them away and past it. Yes a game needs to evolve and continue but they wanted to evolve their story, and push Warcraft into a new era past its RESOUNDING initial success. And now that they have it⌠They feel secure in giving us what weâve asked for for near a decade in a hope to bring back those people that absolutely loved classic.
Mddsteve, it sounds like perhaps you arent quite as interested in classic as others and thats okay. Its no biggie⌠But you dont have to be a wet blanket, because im pretty sure at this point anybody BEING a wet blanket is just pissing on themselves out of spite.
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I never post on the forums. Iâm posting here because this topic affects me, and the forums are meant to be one avenue to voice your opinions on them and/or have meaningful discussion with other members of the community. I am not saying any one particular viewpoint is correct or not (including mine). Iâm sharing mine because others likely share it, and while Blizzardâs philosophy is the only one that matters, it is shaped, at least somewhat, by the community. That is why weâre getting Classic in the first place ( a stance Blizzard vehemently opposed in the past). Iâm not pretending about anything, my stance is clear: I donât see how allowing rewards earned in Classic to be shown in Retail will negatively impact Classic itself. If anything, by definition (the rewards from classic would also be accessible IN RETAIL), it affects retail more than/instead of Classic. I view it the same as a low level alt riding around the newest mythic mount, or a new character showing off cosmetics from before that character could/did exist: It is a reflection of the time and effort that YOU as a player have spent on blizzard games. If Classic is meant to be a different game than WoW, thatâs fine! Blizzard does cross-game promotions and rewards all the time.
Different people play games for different reasons, there is no way to state or control what those reasons should be, you can only state what your intention is with a game or product and who you intend to cater to. âThen Classic isnât for youâ is so unbelievably non-inclusive to the type of communities Blizzard tries to build, that I thought it would be worth voicing my opinion on it. I will still be playing Classic either way, but I can tell you that Iâd care a lot more about it if I felt like my time and hard work could be shown off on retail as well, as I donât know what Classic will look like in 5-10 years (if it is still there), but I expect Retail to be, and intend to be playing on it.
I have plenty of rewards that are no longer obtainable, and if they became obtainable again, that really doesnât affect me. Iâve already got them. PLUS I can showcase the fact that I got them âoriginallyâ / long ago, if that was something I cared about (I donât). As I mentioned in my original reply, I think the difficulty in obtaining something is more relevant than if itâs obtained years later. Classic will be more difficult than other means of obtaining the same rewards (on retail) that I also mentioned in my original reply.
I donât want them to âmess with Classicâ. I donât think this issue negatively affects Classic. I think this is an additional incentive and benefit for retail players to experience classic. If people are really this excited about Classic, I donât think the ability for rewards to be used in retail will deter them from playing it. But I DO think that retail players who might otherwise not care (as much) about Classic would be more inclined to try it if they knew their time on Classic could be added to consolidated hub of (potentially 20+ years of) their accomplishments.
Iâm attempting to share my viewpoint and promote positive discussion about the issue. Telling people theyâre feigning concern or saying âitâs just not for you, move onâ doesnât seem like positive discussion to me. I find it hard to believe there is not a solution that MOST people would agree on (certainly more than such a divisive stance people seem to have now), which is why I even offered the topic up of TLP servers, separate from the incoming Classic release. I wonât beat the dead horse here, but I think discussion is important and I wanted to clarify where I stand on the topic and dismiss any insincerity.
Classic was not about skill, it was Rock Paper Scissors and then gear and then skill after all that
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All of these people trying to get old items included so they can get transmogs for BFA are going to strongly affect classic.
Coming in here so solely request and argue with the forums to include something they have stated multiple times they WILL NOT include is childish⌠Stupid⌠And very clearly displays their own motives for playing classic would TO BE ONLY FOR COSMETIC REWARDS ON RETAIL EDITION not to play classic for what classic IS.
Classic isnt for those people. Who are arguing. Begging. Crying. Throwing damn tantrums because blizzard isnt giving them the rewards they earn on classic on current. Once they ACCEPT the fact they will -NOT- be given anything more or less than VANILLA WOW they will be happy to play and continue. But until they reach that acceptance, with the mindset âWELL BUT PLAYING IN CLASSIC SHOULD BENEFIT MY BFA/RETAIL ACCOUNTâ and crying like 3 year olds who were told no they cant have a second scoop of ice cream - Classic will not be for them.
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Elynos
Im sorry but⌠gitgud.
I never had issues. Even in PvP blues at rank 11 before you could farm out epic PvP gear.
Rock paper scissors, and then knowing how to use the paper to tie the scissors down when you run across the class thats your âscissorsâ skill came into large parts of this, and knowing how to play your class and specâŚ
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It absolutely would have a negative impact. I would have to wonder if each new recruit was actually interested in classic, or if they were going to bail the second they got what they wanted.
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No, but common sense does.
Should my incentive to play a game be playing the game?
Or should it be playing a game I donât want to for rewards in a game I want to play?
Furthermore i donât want to have to worry if each new guild member is actually interested in classic or just there for retail rewards
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And they already have your dollar. So what does making rewards transfer get them? Nothing. But you know what it would do? It would make people who do want classic ubsub or just not sub. So congrats, blizzard would be losing money.
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Wrong. Itâs possible for a level 50 to outskill and kill a level 60. Itâs actually quite common in earlier days of WoW.