I struggle to understand how Gluttony procs are wasted in M+ when you’re the only tank.
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It can be a wasted process if it goes off towards the en of a pack when you don’t need it or as your done with the group and you just happen to proc it by picking up a soul. But it can be mitigated to an extent.
It is mostly that they proc at a time when you don’t need it.
If it procs when you’re taking damage it’s not really being wasted.
If it procs when the healer isn’t stressed or you aren’t taking much damage, then it is mostly wasted.
I dropped it and went back to Spirit Bomb because procs that weren’t in the first half of any particular pull weren’t really accomplishing much.
Gluttony is much more attractive on Tyrannical weeks, or Bolstering/Raging weeks where there is still a noticeable threat after the first mob or two dies IMO.
Huh, I can’t imagine wanting it on Tyrannical weeks. That’s when you can pull lots of trash at once and enjoy the spb dps.
Theres an essence that helps tons, even at rank 1 at 45s its acts as demon spikes. DH’s shouldnt be as bad as people say they are, sure im not going to do 25’s with one, but 2-15’s are perfectly fine.
If your biggest concern in the dungeon is not dying to Tyrannical Sisters/Tidesages/etc, then Gluttony is going to give value through the entire boss fight as opposed to turning mostly useless once a mob or two dies.
I wouldn’t say it is the best option overall since the problem is usually dps/healer dying to mechanics, but that is where I’d think about it more.
No, we agree on the general consensus of Gluttony. I enjoy it on occasion, but there are wasted procs with it. My meaning about wasted procs was that sometimes when I was finishing up a group and about to start down the hallway (such as Kings’ Rest or some other dungeon) it would proc from a soul I picked up wasting the whole proc with no mobs around. So like I said, there are wasted procs, but it can be mitigated to an extent, like avoiding extra souls if you are finished with a pack and going to the next and such.
Now, I don’t dislike Gluttony, I used to run it a lot in Legion, as it was a fun little proc to have going off. I recently tried it in our normal alt raid to see how it works with the Vision Essence +Gluttony and it gave me a lot more buffer between Demon Spike charges. I enjoyed the brick wall feeling I got from having meta up so long on certain bosses. I haven’t really tried it in any high level keys in the 10+ range yet, as I just haven’t had the time to play my Vengeance tank a lot. Been mostly pushing on my Guardian Druid lately, but I plan to get into it a bit more soon.
Gluttony isn’t a good talent because it isn’t a reliable gap filler in our mitigation. It often procs while Demon Spikes is up, which is pretty useless. I think this is a poor trade for losing out on the disproportionate damage gains from Spirit Bomb.
If they changed it to proc after X number of soul fragments consumed so that it is predictable, I think it would be more competitive.
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Gluttony is a pretty serious waste in 10s.
It is my alt at the moment, used to be my main. I’m not going to be pushing keys into the 15s and 17s on him. His gear is just okay for pushing comfortably into 10s and 11s. Talents are only relevant as compared to the characters gear. Where as my Druid drops mitigation while running 10s and such, as I just don’t need it, sometimes depending on how good the healer is it might be better to have more mitigation on my Vengeance tank. It is only relevant to their gear levels.
Also, I shouldn’t have to tell you, but you can make a dungeon harder or easier damage wise, depending on how much you can pull. More mitigation allows me to pull much bigger. I still prefer Spirit Bomb for big pulls due to the HPS and damage, but it is fun toying around with Gluttony. I’ve always wanted that talent to be more viable and with visions essence it finally feels that way.
Also, nice Segway away from the fact I pointed out there are wasted procs with Gluttony. I see you had to change the topic.
Had to change the topic? Why would I have to do anything?
Glut/VoP is a waste at +10. Didn’t need the combo at 415 when 8.2 hit, sure as hell don’t need it now.
Because you were wrong in saying there aren’t any wasted procs.
Congratulations on tanking 10s at 415 at the start of the season. I was tanking 10s around 408-410 iLevel as I took most of season 2 off and only really played my Druid during the end of season 2 when I came back. My Demon Hunter has been on the back burner for awhile, but I still enjoy playing him on occasion. Unfortunately with guild needs and work lately, I haven’t had as much time as I would like to put into playing him more. Recent changes with the addition of essences have piqued my interest though, and despite your feelings on the matter, you can test builds out in lower keys like 10s and 11s to just see how viable they are and how they work.
I had to scroll up to see what you’re fixating on, I never said there aren’t any wasted procs. If you are still taking damage, the Gluttony proc isn’t wasted. That would be like saying Impassive Visage ticks are wasted when you’re at 80% hp.
How to generate more pain faster to spend souls?
Paladins are designed to mitigate more damage and heal less, vdh are designed to mitigate less and heal more.
If you look at the spectrum, tanks that mitigate more, heal less (warriors, who mitigate the most but have almost no self healing) and tanks that mitigate less, heal more (bdks, who heal the most, but have the least mitigation)
So just saying “it’s squishy” is a literally worthless metric. Ehrps is a more accurate measurement of how “squishy” a tank is.
…what?
You can’t just remove the self healing factor from the equation of how “tanky” a tank is. If you’re attempting to, by your metric a bdk would be the bottom tank by far.
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Take Fracture. But ironically, you’ll be then sitting in the other end of spectrum: sitting on way too much pain with no souls.
If anything, they need to slightly bump Shear to generate 15 pain. It makes a huge difference when we need to ‘spam’ 3 Shear for 1 Soul Cleave, while 2 Fracture gives ample wiggle room left.
I often run m+ with a VDH tank, and by far he’s the tankiest tank that ever tanked for me. Between his absorbs and self healing, he often heals as much as I do on tank damage pulls, 35-40K HPS.
- the tank you are healing should know when to use the skills given for the class,
in case of demon hunter is a waist to use spikes on normal hits, should be activated just before a big hit/ special skill of the boss to endure it. - should be the case of excessive healing since DH can heal themselves, I have mythinc + 12 where I tanked the boss by myself since the group die and survived
- tanks are been balanced between, block, dodge, parry, self healing,amor and HP, each tank class have a different mix of this, warriors and pally have a shield so it give them a constant block rate, while other might have a higher parry/avoidance or even higher armor and HP,
be careful while describing a particular class vs a particular player.