Except Sylvanas targeted them specifically to destroy them as a people.
The very objective of a genocide.
Especially within the context that she already had the island completely under her control. Its not like she was still fighting the NEs inside. The battle was over and Horde had won.
This was no collateral damage.
[citation needed]
She targeted them because they were the only Alliance force the Horde could reasonably attack without immediate Alliance reprisal.
Patty Matson while an absolute sweet heart has proven multiple times she isnât actually following the story.
In that same interview when asked she said that Sylvanas loves Baine because Sylvanas loves animals.
He was fighting for it, then he realized Sylvanas wanted to make it into a terrorist organization, so he betrayed the terrorist Horde not HIS Horde.
In Cata he abandoned it to save the literal world, in Pandaria he still had to heal the damage done to the world(according to ToW), In WoD he rejoined us to battle the Iron Horde, he only unjustifiably abandoned us in Legion.
While not a perfect leader by any means, he had to make these tough decisions 3/4 times to abandon the Horde to save the world.
He tried reason, several times.
In fact, reason is literally the ONLY thing Baine does in this game.
-He tried to reason in BtS, before the war begun, in which Sylvanas responded by forcing Baine to cease his diplomatic relationship with Anduin.
-He reasoned at the Battle for Lordaeron, in which Sylvanas responded by telling him heâs welcome to get himself killed along with saurfang.
-He reasoned with her over the raising of Derek Proudmoore and she responds by being a smart @$$ and mocking the Horde phrase âVictory or Deathâ and saying that âdeath is mine to masterâ.
-He reasoned with her even after he committed treason, she responded by murdering Zelling right in front of all the gathered Horde leaders.
Sheâs not listening to his reason, so he must treason.
A problem which was solved through the death of Xera and Anduin reintroducing him to Alonsos Faol.
I mean, I wouldnât call it betrayal, sheâs literally been tirelessly fighting for her people within the twisting nether for thousands of years.
Itâs more like being incredibly out of the loop and disconnected from her people, now knowing what theyâve been through while she was away fighting with her hubby and glowing space goats for thousands of years.
But yeah, youâre right about her not making the effort to understand her people the way they are now. Iâll give you this one.
What does that mean? Sheâs still a leader though.
The thing is, everyone else you listed arenât selfish.
-Thrall left the Horde to save the planet.
-Saurfang betrayed the Horde to save the Horde.
-Baine betrayed the Horde to save the Horde.
-Turalyon abandoned the Alliance to save Azeroth and likely countless other worlds.
-Alleria abandoned Quelâthalas to save them as well as other worlds.
-Tyrande transformed into the Noght Warrior to avenge those she couldnât save.
Each of these people did something selfish for a non-selfish reason. Sylvanas and Gallywix on the other hand literally only does selfish things for selfish reasons, which is why they lack in the leadership department.
Read a good war.
Fixed that for you.
âItâs a game, broâ âKill every last traitor to Sylvanas! And anyone who opposes her or expresses any modicum of criticism of her actions should be insulted!â âThe people love Sylvanas! Believe me! She is so popular! All the people on the Horde love her!â
Yeah, the Orcish Horde that was a tool of the Legion sent to Azeroth to weaken itsâ defenses. Not the one weâre paying 15$ a month to play.
Thereâs a reason why the WRITERS keep saying the people support Sylvanas, but no reason why any of the characters are saying it. What has she done to earn such adoration and âloveâ from a people who, up until recently, didnât trust a single thing she said?
More like the literal embodiment of what it means to be Scourge.
-Amoral undead ruler
-Uses her forces as sacrificial pawns
-Lacks empathy or compassion for those she leads
-Seeks to annihilate all life on the planet to create an empire of undeath that she thinks is more suited to the defense of the planet.
-Indiscriminately murders innocent people
-Raises the dead to turn against their former allies
She literally checks out all the boxes in the scourge playbook, now all she needs is an ancient cursed blade created by evil entities used to dominate the will of othersâŚ
Works for me.
No she doesnt read it again. Its never about the Elves put any Alliance race in the same position and she would do the same thing. Its about destroying the Allianceâs ability to function as a faction. Her goal is simply to create a divide within the Alliance government paralyzing them while the Horde builds it power to become the dominate superpower.
She helped to defeat the Legion apparently the Horde and Alliance fought battles off screen because she is given a heroes welcome in Org.
She also took all of Ashenvale which would have an immediate effect on the life style of everyone living in Org. Tons of food and resources would be flowing into Org and its likely settlers have started moving in to Ashenvale itself.
The Zandalari would see her as a savior for what the Horde did to stop Zul. They would also see her as an avenging Hero for Rastakhan.
Shes already a hero to the Blood Elves even after death she has given them aid for years. Also with Jaina active they are going to be a lot of support for fighting her after Dalaran as we saw with Baine.
The Darkspear have suffered more than any Horde race at the hands of the Kulâtirans. Fighting them would be very popular when you think of how many lost family to their attacks during and after the Third War.
This whole post is tea. The general populace doesnât have access to Sylvanasâ inner thoughts like we do. From the outside she is a decorated war hero who champions the horde better than a vast majority of other characters. The people loving Sylvanas is not hard to believe at all
As for the bad things sheâs done⌠actual governments commit atrocities all of the time in the real world. Most people will say âOh thatâs terrible.â and move on with their everyday lives.
And then she wants to destroy Stormwind and turn its population into undead.
Except it canât be disconnected from the real world because the real world is the only reference for the writerâs fiction. Just look at the cultures of the races across warcraft, sure they may not belong to any one individual human culture but all of them to do spawn from human cultures. Humans obviously have heavy medieval european influences, Trolls african/jamaican.
Sure blizzard is generally pretty good at mixing them up so that they canât be claimed to belong solely to one particular culture, but all the little bits that make them up were inspired by something and humans can only be inspired by real life. I may not have the historical knowledge to point out each an every piece of each races culture, but they all come from something or somewhere in human history; even if its just being based off of someone elseâs fantasy fiction because that original piece or the pieces preceding it, must have been inspired in the first place and something had to trigger than inspiration.
Youâve also gotta keep in mind that even if nothing in this universe plays out the way it would in the real world that those things are still politics. If blizzard glorifyâs sylvanas after she committs genocide thatâs politics. If Arthas won and managed to push back the burning legion? Thatâs a whole mess of politics; its saying dictators can be ok, that we should never question our leaders, killing everyone for the greater good is fine, single ethno-states are better.
On the other hand if Arthas failed itâd be a repudiation of all or most of those things.
You literally just proved my point.
What exactly did she do off-screen that would earn her this unabashed, non-reserved, support from the general populace. More importantly, why wasnât it important enough to show ON-SCREEN?
Thatâs like if I decided that Gulâdan was now a revered figure by the Horde because he acted heroically at some point during the 2nd war. Like, how would a figure as feared, hated, and reviled such as Gulâdan suddenly become seen as a great hero because of something he did off-screen? Such a massive change in the general perception of a figure like that would be daunting.
SAURFANG took Ashenvale.
No, theyâll see US as a saviors for defeating Zul, heck, BAINE did more to aid in fighting Zul than Sylvannas did.
They will see US, as well as Rokhan and Nathanos as avenging heroes for Rastakhan. Sylvanas didnât contribute jack to that.
No, she isnât. The Blood elves only respect her out of the memory of her living self. They see her now as a perversion of the hero she once was, and view her now with superstition and unease.
With Jaina active, she was able to manipulate some among the Sunreavers still upset over the purge of Dalaran to her side.
Whatâs your point even? People who enjoy fictional characters that donât line up with modern societal morals are evil? All fiction must end with a fairy tale ending where good prevails and all evil is expunged otherwise the author of said fiction is excusing and supporting evil? Are you just reaching in an attempt to shame people who like characters you donât and try to maintain your imagined moral high ground? I donât get it.
That writerâs should be careful about what they write and treat certain topics with respect due to the fact that the politics in their fiction can and will influence its consumers. No, it doesnât all have to be fairy tale endings, but at the least certain things should be portrayed as positive; e.g. genocide, racism, sociopathy. The characters in the story can enjoy them, but they shouldnât be glorified for it.
As well as the idea that the consumers themselves should be aware of these things when discussing the product and take them into account. For example saying this like âits just warâ in reference to Teldrassil delutes how vile the act of Teldrassil was while simultaneously lowering the bar for what is and isnât acceptable in war. Sure, its just fiction; but people pick up on politics from fiction and change their worldviews based on it, its not a fast process in most cases, but it is a process. âUncle Tomâs Cabinâ for example is a work of fiction that is often credited as having a role in America electing Lincoln and going to its eventual civil war because it changed so many minds.
No, WoW isnât a book, but it is still a piece of fiction whoâs message reaches millions. Thatâs the sort of thing that needs to be handled with some level of tact. There are reasons why works of fiction can be banned after all. And itâs not just because their story might suck.
It is possible for people to consume fiction in a vacuum. Not every book, video game, movie needs to be an in-depth commentary on society and morals. While I agree that Blizzard has shown they do not possess the writing ability to handle topics like genocide gracefully, they are entitled to try and fail and they will be ridiculed for it as they constantly are on this forum.
I do not see the story of World of Warcraft as anything beyond entertainment and I do not apply my real life morals to it in any significant capacity because if I did, I would have never gotten past the âKill x amount of furry animals for their peltsâ quest.
If people have feelings about the story they are entitled to talk about them here but they need to understand that not everyone is going to view the story through the same lens as they do.
Fixed that for you.
Even Golden has compared Garrosh to Hitler.
Keep being awesome, Patty. Have a 