Patch Themes Should not Affect Gameplay

This is the stupidest comparison I’ve seen on the forums in a while and that’s saying a lot. We are not children to be scolded. Unlike children and parents, WE pay Blizzard, who is going to get a huge wakeup call when they have a lot less cash incoming. Because, unlike children, we will walk away.

Where are these piles of things wrecking the game? Only the things Blizzard has been putting in game which the players – try to follow me here – DO NOT FIND FUN. Being at war with you playerbase because “WAH you don’t like HOW they’re playing the game” is the childish move. It will cost them.

1 Like

The way people act on these forums could have fooled me. In all seriousness though the way the community reacts to Blizzard tweaks (buffs or nerfs) is very tantrum like. I will quit if you do X. I will quit if you do not do X. It is a viscous cycle and I am looking forward to the potential of this change in direction. It is nothing but potential right now but that is all the hope I got because what they have been doing is slowly killing the game.

Okay… don’t be that way. Simple.

It’s not really a cycle. A cycle implies there are ups and downs. People threatening blizzard is a constant.

I hear this sentence said a lot. It’s always spoken in vaguery and never provided with examples.
Mind clearing up for me what exactly “they have been doing [that] is slowly killing the game”? Also, what separates what they have been doing vs what they’re about to do with covenants? Why are you optimistic about covenants and pessimistic about the past?

Look forward to you clearing all that up for me.

E X A C T L Y.

What they are doing is killing this game – and the stranglehold the covenants will put on players is just ONE MORE THING TO KILL THE GAME. People do not pay money to be frustrated by piles of restrictive systems.

Nope, can’t do that.
Nope, can’t do that either.
Nope, can’t do that thing you really need right now.
Nope, can’t do that thing which looks fun.

At some point, people get tired of “nope, can’t do that” and it turns into “nope, I’m not giving you more money for a non-game”. They’re going to pass the tipping point of sub loss and then the resulting losses will not be a snowball rolling downhill, they’ll be an avalanche of people leaving because they don’t have enough people to play with, and there will be no stopping it once that happens.

They ticked off enough people with BfA (including eventually myself and I liked BfA for the first half…) they can not afford to tick off another huge number of people right now. They need to reconnect with their playerbase, instead of treating their playerbase like an enemy.

You might want Daddy Blizzard to tell you what you want but most people are not interested in being TOLD what they want. Most people are perfectly able to figure that out themselves.

Yup, nothing wrong with quest storylines giving me different armor, mounts, aesthetics overall, or achievements.
Everything wrong with quest storylines impacting my performance in m+, mythic raiding, and competitive pvp.

1 Like

Yep, covenants are going to be a train wreck worse than azerite armor.

You can see it coming down the tracks here:

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/covenants-and-your-spec-a-survey/616438

1 Like

Yea but they wont.

Blizzards current dev team is rather arrogant in their design choices. Most of our complaining is white noise, they don’t respond until Content Creators start calling them out, and they know they can’t ignore anymore.

Ions interview with Preach was just an hour of Ion trying to say “Yea, sucks you don’t like it, but we feel its best, so.”

1 Like

yeah dog, blizzard removed meaningful RPG choices by tying player power to the covenants, and then said that was the very reason they were doing it.

its kind of like slapping someone so they dont get slapped.

2 Likes

I just love that people keep wanting them to pull the ripcord, when we aren’t even out of the plane. You are not hearing the Devs. They want the systems to go live. If the majority of players (ie NOT the forums) have problems with the systems, they can THEN pull the ripcord. Not before.

The issue with the dev team is it seems they don’t understand the importance of differentiating what “meaningful choices” means in the context of the world, and in the context of max-level gameplay.

If covenants were all about pursuing the storyline you like, chasing after mounts and armor sets that are more appealing to you (like liking a netherworld Druid set vs vampire attire), and altering your experience in the world that would be really cool. I’d enjoy that, because I choose in what context my character progresses, for no other reason than my enjoyment. Aesthetics aren’t changing my gameplay, but they do affect my character, and for a lot of people, they are meaningful.

1 Like

And they’ve been told over and over, not just by the forums, that covenants are like a concrete block ready to sink shadowlands. What do they even have beta for if they refuse to listen to feedback?

Since WotLK the game has slowly died. That is supported with population decline. WotLK was the last expansion that really had vestiges from the Vanilla days still in it. Maybe it is a coincidence but I do not think so. They have made changes after changes. Some at our request and others not. This I see as a test run to see if they (Blizzard) should make more ‘route’ options players can take in creating the character they want to play. I might be wrong both in it being good and what Blizzard’s intent actually is. As long as they are doing something different from what has obviously not been working in terms of growing the player base I am open to the idea.

By who? The forums? The forums cannot be pleased, so who do you listen to?

Do…do you read before replying?

What about my OP indicates I don’t “hear the devs”.
Engaging in conversation about how covenants should be designed is not mutually exclusive with understanding the devs want to implement them as they are

Why? You’re saying it’s been dying. I’m asking you why. As I said before, you’re pessimistic about the past, but optimistic about the future. Why?

Such as? Vagueries.

Exceptionally vague.

Vagueries.

Oh yeah, streamers. Yay. They know everything about the game. Except what the future holds. Ultimately, they need to see the data when the game goes live.

I don’t care either way. Just not sure where everyone is getting their supporting data. Voicing opinions does not make people the majority, or even the best litmus test on what works and does not.

Once I get that far, I’ll pick what I like, regardless of what is “best” subjectively, whether it is locked or unlocked. People just need to understand that this heavy of a train isn’t going to stop in the next two months.

Why?
If blizzard told us “we’re going to implement a raiding system where you can only get loot from one boss the entire raid”, we would reply “no, that’s absurd”.
We wouldn’t need to wait for the game to go live to know in advance that this would be a horrendous system.

It’s not subjective. If I want to min/max, I have to be ven’thyr.

If you can not fill in the blanks I am not going to waste my time telling you. This argument is not for someone with so little knowledge of WoW’s history. I will name a few examples though and you can take it from there. For ‘changes after changes’ you have LFR, removing elites in the world, and world scaling. There are many more but that should give you the head start you need.

I like how you’re tying to invalidate that the vast majority of feedback, from all platforms, not just the forums and content creators, is negative. Carry on I guess.

Except we have enough data from past experiences that we do know what the future holds. Blizzard was told repeatedly that azerite gear was bad. They pushed it through as it was because “the people giving feedback can’t really know it’s bad” (your argument), then spent half an expac reworking it, because surprise surprise, it was bad. They are doing the exact same thing now. We can expect the same result. Probably worse this time actually, because covenants are way worse than azerite armor ever was.

1 Like

Lol.
There is nothing wrong with lfr. It’s a system that lets the very casual players still participate in raiding content, if only a primitive version of it. It has no effect on other gameplay.
What’s wrong with world scaling?
There are elites in the world. There are a lot of them. Have you been playing the game?

1 Like