i tested out the 30% and seems bugged. its not even 1%. try it with and without, you will see no diference on healing done
Huh? I have used VE with and without imp VE and at least at the time it seemed to affect it properly
You are entirely misunderstanding the issue.
The design of healing → damage is NOT the problem.
Healer mages do substantially lower damage than dps mages when they heal, as they should. It’s still very high for healer dps but thats fine. Mage healers also must ACTIVELY, and CONSTANTLY be managing their beacons and timing their healing properly.
I main disc in retail and mained healer mage in p1.
The problem with shadow is that it is doing the FULL dps of a mediocre dps AND the hps of an actual healer completely passively after pressing the VE button once
The reason I played so much shadow this phase was BECAUSE I was doing top (or mid, post nerf) dps while also doing mid/top healing. It’s got no opportunity cost whatsoever for doing that healing and as a result cannot be allowed to be top-ish damage in pve until VE is nerfed.
The problem is entirely the lack of opportunity cost. I actually am kinda confused how you even drew the conclusion of “healing via damage is the problem” from what I said the first time…because that is not the problem whatsoever
Edit: p.s. having a shadow priest in the raid can absolutely substitute for a second healer right now, while casting zero heals. Zero. One press of VE is all it takes to do healer hps while doing full dps. If that’s not a balance problem then idk what is.
If you’re counting overhealing, then yeah it’s very easy to outheal any dedicated healing class, and shadow HPS looks super impressive with overhealing taken into consideration, but it’s just not that crazy when I actually look at the numbers.
Across a handful of of my logs (That I used VE in), my overheal is around 80%. My effective hps is 80, split across 5 people is 16 hps per person, of actual, useful healing, barely better than a rank 4 renew.
At no point have I asked for shadow to be top DPS, but putting it on track to be outclassed by meme specs like frost mage is ridiculous.
Any dps can substitute for a second healer right now. The only fight that’s tough to solo heal is menagerie. I haven’t even been using VE unless it’s all I have to cast during movement.
Yeah I’d say a few things.
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Vamp Embrace has a lot of throughput potential but it is distributed, constant raid healing which isn’t always super helpful. And yeah, right now the raid is very trivial given the gear folks have at this point in the phase, so single healing isn’t much of a problem.
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For fights that are not very armor heavy and are single target, spriest isn’t mediocre dps… it is the last dps per WCL (including being out DPS’d by every tank and tied with bear tanks which have next to 0 recorded logs). In specific raids you might out dps others (I certainly do), but in aggregate, they perform the worst just looking at the data.
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If VE is the issue for balancing the DPS, maybe there is a way they can incorporate it into a rune so that you have to make a choice on how you want to play? But I don’t think VE is as powerful in practice as it is on paper… and I’m not sure it justifies sub tank-level dps.
VE is strong right now. Not in the future. Spriests do not scale well even with these runes, and VE is not going to be anywhere near as strong at 60. A nerf is unnecessary.
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This is probably because your in the caster group, which most shadow priests are, but last night when I was in our MELEE group. I was doing over 200 hps on most fights. I was the top healer in the group as a shadowpriest. Our disc kept complaining that there was nothing to heal because I was healing so much. Melee always takes damage in some form or another no matter what. So being able to keep the tank and all the melee completly topped is not over healing, they’re actually taking dmg consistently . Now In the caster group, unless it’s a warlock, everyone else ur over healing
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Why on earth would I include overheal in my assessment? What kind of bizarre bad faith argument is this?
Wasn’t a bad faith argument, I just assumed your raid wasn’t standing in fire/gas clouds on purpose. Not sure where the damage is coming from otherwise that would let you put out hundreds of hps of effective healing lol. Unfortunate raid group you have, I guess.