Sexy and powerful is a power fantasy for men and women. There are women who want an hourglass figure for the same reason there’s men who want bulging muscles.
I agree that Flynn was written for the ladies, and I never had a problem with him despite being male myself.
It’s a typical ideologue tactic - accuse a good-looking female character of being sexually objectified while saying “men don’t get objectified, visually good-looking men are a only male power fantasy”. Can you name these studies instead of just saying they exist?
By the way, you claim to only interject in discussions of Sylvanas where she’s being subject to sexism… but you interjected into my discussion with other people about Sylvanas’ split soul on the thread “Sylvanas Divided Soul”, then deleted your comment, proving your previous claim false (don’t deny you did it, I’ve got screencaps).
I had earned respect for you last week, but I’m revoking that respect.
It’s rude of you to ask for sources when you know full well we can’t post links in this forum.
I bet you are going to turn around and use the fact that we can’t post links as an excuse how you ‘won’ this argument. You are unreal. You could listen to women but you choose to argue with them instead.
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There being issues with Sylvanas doesn’t mean they apply to every good-looking female character in WoW or every good-looking female character.
it’s not about looks it’s about casual sexism.
And I’m exhausted. Please don’t engage with me again, I have no interest in talking to you again.
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You keep using that term. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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the clinical term is “ambivalent sexism” as there are four types of sexism, but I used small words for small brains.
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What do you mean? Links can be posted here. People do it all the time.
you need to have a certain level of trust before you can post links.
If that’s the case, just say your trust level isn’t high enough. Besides, there are ways around that.
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Don’t be obtuse. You don’t need to add links; you can give me names, dates and places of the studies in question and I can research them.
Call it by its clinical term or use a colloquialism, it doesn’t change the fact that I don’t think you understand what it is.
Or you can just do your own research Wikipedia is just a Google search away.
I’m not your secretary. If you can google the flood you can google sexism.
Google “ambivalent sexism” don’t be a barbarian and pretend you don’t know how to use a computer and the internet. You could even google “casual sexism” and get a lot of hits.
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If you make the claim, the burden of proof is on you to provide evidence.
Ironically, I suspected you were going to edit in a personal attack against me after posting your initial reply… and I was right lol
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you can choose to be ignorant but that’s entirely on you.
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For someone who prides themselves on science and evidence – I mean, I’m a Christian, so what do I know? – you make a lot of baseless claims and personal attacks instead.
Can you even give me the name of one university where this study took place, or one scientist who undertook it?
The theory has largely been developed by social psycologists Peter Glyck,PHD and Susan Fiske, PHD.
Susan Fiske is President of Psycology at Princeton University, with a specializtion in Social Psycology. Peter Glyck is a psychology and bias expert at Lawrence University. His field is in stereotyping and internalized biases.
She coined the theory and published her findings, he was the peer who reviewed her study.
Is that satisfactory? or are you going to go out of your way now to somehow discredit them both? I have provided the information you asked for and now I’ve added you to my block list. I’m done talking to you Thadeus.
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Thank you for providing facts. I’ll look them up.
I’ve actually heard of Susan Fiske, but I don’t know much about her except that she’s published several books and I saw her on the documentary “The Red Pill”.
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You are redpilled? that makes so much sense. Get out more, expose yourself to different things expand your worldview. Get out of the Conservative Christian male alt right bubble you seem to be in. Rejoin normal society.
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I thought you blocked me, how can you see my post? I only replied to you for the benefit of anyone else who reads our discussions.
You only get 2 out of 6 for your assessment of me; the only things you got right about me are that I’m male and Christian (but genuine kudos to you for knowing that conservative doesn’t automatically equal Christian and vica versa).
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The subject of your post is very interesting and I think it’s worth looking into more. Whether Illidan and Flynn can be viewed in a male or female gaze is open to interpretation and can also change depending on the instances they’re seen in. It’s also important to note that the two are very contrasting characters, in that Flynn is light hearted and comedic while Illidan is dark and serious. Neither of them have been in the same situations and if they were to swap places it’d be bizarre. What if Flynn were to sneak through crowds of demons in the Well Of Eternity dungeon, or if we had to do an escort quest involving a drunk Illidan?
Part of it might be that they’re products of their time. Illidan was created in the 90s by young men who happened to be fans of comics, and if he were created by young men who are fans of comics created today he’d probably be a different character. When it comes to what characters that guys think are cool, I think of Garrosh and Varian, who were leaders that were loved by their people at some point in time. Illidan is viewed as an emo incel who is disliked by most people in the Warcraft universe, and it’s a bizarre fantasy for anyone to want to be that. Illidan is also an antihero though so he doesn’t fit into the typical hero fantasy.
I think an important part of having a character that’s a power fantasy for men is that they’re someone who is a role model, which Illidan is not. You mentioned Illidan being buff and shirtless caters to the male gaze, but I don’t think so. Buff shirtless men is something that usually caters to women, and buff shirtless men are primary characters in films such as Magic Mike and Fifty Shades Of Gray. The first Fifty Shades movie is made with the female gaze in mind. There’s also the fact that most men don’t view strippers as role models, whether it’s a man or woman.
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Shirtless men actually represents a male body standard, its like the opposite of female beauty standards. Since men are very visual the male gaze focuses on very physical things. The male gaze was coined by film theorist Laura Mulvey who wrote a film analysis for the movie Rear Window discussing this topic. It’s interesting for sure.
Speculative, but not definitive.
This is not scientifically backed by academics, it’s just an interesting filmography theory that’s gotten a lot of attention in recent years.
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