It seems that the plants are going to be one more level of “salting the earth” as far as the Kaldorei are concerned. First the indigenous life is wiped out by the Blight and the goblins, and next the WoD plants take over everything. If it weren’t for the Well, they wouldn’t have much of anything to return to.
And to be honest, I wouldn’t mind the shake up so much, if it weren’t so humiliating for the Kaldorei. This is the ultimate victory of the Horde over the Kaldorei, where the Kaldorei, who are elves and thus have a bond to the land that beggars the imagination, are permanently driven from their homes to the cheering of the Horde. It will be the ultimate act of evil deeds paying off if wiping out the Night Elves, and permanently driving the survivors from their home, works out for the Horde. I really hope that something happens so the story doesn’t go in that direction.
Edit: I swear, if it were anyone but the Horde driving the Night Elves from their homes, I would be on board with this.
And THAT would certainly be an easy route to go. However … like I said there are signs of things going to the completely opposite way. The induction of SO MANY native Draenor species onto Kalimdor. The increased fortification and reclaiming of cities in Northern EK by the Alliance. These things are curious if the route is to have both decimated peoples get their original territories back (and sorry, I know that is a horrific concept … but it is one that should be at least minded).
For me (if we assume its the JunkerGnomes for the Gnome AR; and the Kelfin/Vulpera for the Goblin AR) … I have this terrible gut feeling that the FINAL two ARs (and I expect only 2 more) will have a HEAVY impact on how territories will appear at the end of BfA.
I am just wondering what they will do about the rest of the horde and alliance zones/holdings on each continent? Maybe it was more of a figure of speech, to say each side is moving from one end to the other.
If they ever do another world changing event (not like cata, but redo the zones) if they will show this reorganization. They would have to move feathermoon stronghold, and any night elf holdings else where in Kalimdor. Same with horde strongholds in EK. I just personally don’t like red and blue continents. No reason to be at war with another.
Well, I wouldn’t go THAT far (and I HIGHLY doubt that the Exodar and Silvermoon are going anywhere; hell, they might actually see MORE relevance being the SOLE representation of their factions remaining on the opposing factions continent). However, yes, I DO think that if Blizz decided to go the route of “Mostly” Faction Exclusive continents … it would be directly in an effort to “end” (or heavily dilute) the Faction Conflict.
But … this sort of thought-experiment isn’t really productive for a NE thread like this; and is nothing BUT hypothetical for the meantime.
I think after this expac we will see the end of all “major/open” conflict with each faction. Out of good faith from the factions we could see a return of some of the lands both faction gained. (I only say this because if each side is going to work together to take on the old gods and void lords they need to have reduced animosity towards each other.) If Sylvanas is the common enemy like they are building up to then the other horde leaders like Baine and maybe lorthemar would be in favor of this. Calia also has a heavy influence on Anduin, so she may help get the forsaken/Lordaeron citizens back their homelands.
Calia … is a bit of a problem. Yes, I do understand that she is about the ONLY way the Forsaken could ever expect to get their territories in Northern EK back. However, that comes completely at the expense of the entire Forsaken Racial fantasy (which needs to be altered a bit, but shattered to the degree that Calia leading them would)? Her very existence invalidates nearly 15 years of history of the Forsaken. All that suffering, pain, trauma, struggle … washed away as if it was not important because another Menethil needs to be on the throne. Its … disturbing.
She is also part of what I fear when it comes to a “Mostly” Blue EK. There is every possibility that the Kul Tirans are meant to be the Gilnean’s AR (not SW’s). And if that is the case, and if we see signs of Calia Menethil getting an Alliance Brand Light Undead AR … then there is ONLY one place they are going to set them (in Tirisfal Glades … in Lordaeron). As a result, the Gilneans are garaunteed their city back … while the Forsaken will permanently lose their homes. If that happens … with the fate of the Forsaken NEs still very much in the wind … lets just say I’m concerned.
There was something interesting that always stuck with me from back on Draenor:
Those tiny Ancient Saplings didn’t start out hostile.
It’s as if the Botani Cultivators were teaching them, raising them to be hostile.
This always suggested to me that there was a chance to change the Primals for the better. After all, Birchus and Sappy are stomping around in my Garrison right now. And Phylarch the Evergreen is notable, too.
It was unfortunate that Druids didn’t play a bigger role on Draenor, despite the cameos of like the Druids of the Talon.
However, I still hold a positive outlook on the possibility, especially with the Ancient Defender I linked earlier. And Fangraal from Ashran.
Yeah I am hoping she serves as more of an ambassador for the forsaken-alliance relationship. (Not that they are allies by any means. But the families who wish to see each other, without fear of being killed for it. Most are already dead anyway) She doesn’t get to die and come and be there leader, not having shared their plight. But aside from Sylvanas the only other major forsaken characters with real development are Nathanos is and Lilian. Lilian would probably be a fine leader, change of pace from a perfectly preserved body.
As far as night elf holdings they don’t need to be stuffed in Stormwind the rest of their days either. Anyways it’s rumored that SW may be sacked, probably just a rumor though… so is everyone going to be shipped off to boralus and ironforge? Lol
Unless the Horde saving Stormwind is how we go into the next xpac without the faction war hanging over our heads, and without the Horde retaining its designation as the evil faction. The Alliance saves Thunderbluff and the Horde saves Stormwind, which is where the surviving Kaldorei currently reside. Eh… let’s just get this over with.
Hmm … well I doubt they’d end up as refugees either. There is a LOT of territories currently unhabited in Northern EK (and if the Gilneans did end up getting Gilneas back, then I can think of FAR worse neighbors for the Kaldorei than the Wildhammer and Gilneans).
Again, this is all a thought experiment … but LIFE magic has been particularly potent at restoring the corruption of DEATH magic (while LIGHT magic … not so much). Eastern Plaguelands & Western Plaguelands are the ruins of a dead kingdom … and were once the most bountiful territories on EK. NorthEastern Hinterlands also holds previous (very clear) Kaldorei Holdings (as well as the Great Tree Seradane). In such a hypothetical world … the NEs setting up shop THERE is a possibility.
I just don’t see how that does much justice for both forsaken and Kaldorei fans. Although this is Warcraft, many times over races have been able to return to their homes at the conclusion of war. Stormwind is the best example, Draenei in Outland, orcs In Orgrimmar after SoO.
I don’t see trisfal being 100% useable again so I doubt it would be a starting zone in the case of blizz remastering zones. And we know where teldrassil is, so darkshore north would probably be the starting zone for night elves.
As a follow up to myself, there is actually precedent of Draenor Ancients getting along well with the Night Elves. The Draenor Ancients we see on Outland (which have recently gotten model upgrades):
I think originally I would have overlooked Mosswood the Ancient, since he’s part of the Cenarion Expedition faction, so I thought the Druids brought him with them from Azeroth. However, looking at his quest text again, it seems he is from Draenor:
Northeast of here, on the plateau above us lies the burnt ashes of my ancient home. A great wood flourished there before the Burning Legion sent their imps to burn us away. So many died that even centuries later my tired old heart hungers for revenge.
And I think after you complete his small quest chain he has this to say to you:
Horde: “so, this makes us even now, right?”
Nelves: ……
I’m just suspecting this is the way the story will go because, IIRC, Sylvanas mentioned to Saurfang when getting him on board with the war that the Alliance ignored all that the orcs did to redeem themselves of their past transgressions, which made me think that the Horde will do something that the Alliance can’t ignore.
This, of course, ignores just how deep a hole Blizzard dug for the Horde this xpac. Maybe if there had been more resistance to the war, and the people only allowed Sylvanas to live because they were convinced that without her the Alliance would destroy them otherwise, Blizz could sell that sort of logic. It is going to take a really compelling story to fix the mess Blizzard made with this xpac.
In ye olde combat, it is way easier to defend a location than it is to attack it. Those odds are required to actually attempt the attack to begin with, because a lot of people are going to go through the meat grinder while trying to overcome a fortification.
It’s why casualties were so high in Darkshore/Ashenvale. It’s also why the Alliance forces are now conscripting after Lordaeron, the only difference being that Darkshore/Ashenvale was familiar home turf for an army that fights like guerillas, while Lordaeron was a Keep, a death trap fortification built to withstand 10 to 1 odds and win it. Even breaching the front wall, were that anyone could actually manage it, would be of little use, as the fortress is sectioned off to divide and eliminate attacking forces. Moving into one section just lead into another killzone with no means of progression.
To give you an idea on how lethal they are, they had to pay the first men triple, because their odds of coming back were so catastrophically low.
The Horde sustaining so many losses in Darkshore/Ashenvale isn’t to their discredit. That’s just how attacking a fortified location pans out.
This is debatable to wrong 1. I dont know having almost all civilian areas targeted and burnt along side villages like astranaar. sounds very similar.
Are we going to
2. Wrath had a questline, mists had blood elf involvement. warlords a zone of blood elf involvement legion suramar involvement. you can make this argument for tauren, but not for blood elves.
3. Rommath, Aethas.
4. Thats entirely debatable with interesting. Tell me how competent are the night elves? They are now just wood elves. At least since warcraft 3 the blood elves havent been hit with the stupid bat.
True, but games and stories that you immerse yourself in are different from history books. You can only drag the Kaldorei through so much mud without giving them something back before they become a joke, aren’t fun to play or even have in your faction.
The races that were slaughtered by the Burning Legion or Scourge got their revenge. But for the Kaldorei, the best they managed was to kill a trash mob that even human farmers can kill.
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