you are violating key game design principles in favor of your silly notion that warriors don’t deserve to deal good dps because they can potentially tank 
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True. This is part of the “magic” of classic PVP to me. For many classes, the toolkits are large and unused for other things, and a good player uses it. Add in things like engineering and toys and that makes it all even more fun.
Blizzard just changed the PVP system in a way that they considered it to be more healthy and that’s gotten people excited to come back, hell I know a guy who posts here has come back just for that, well that and Whitemane wpvp. So don’t think that messing up classic PVP for the sake of raiding (and yes, I mean seasons PVP) is the best idea. That’s not to say that I’m against changes for seasons because that’s the point of them but I am saying that the “season PVPers” being unhappy because of raid changes, especially when hardcore for the people who didn’t care much for PVP was the last “new thing to come out”, wouldn’t be great.
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Yes. That is how this hybrid thing works in Vanilla. If you have a role other than DPS that you can fulfill you don’t get to compete with the pure classes in personal damage. You should be valuable in terms of overall contribution, and your personal DPS should still be a reasonable percentage of the pure DPS classes, but the pure classes should be decisively above you in personal DPS on average. Warriors are the opposite side of the other hybrid classes and are wildly overtuned.
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You kinda did.
You said you don’t think they should be required for rotational use. Thing is that is not even true in Wrath, its just less important.
Consumes being a big part of PvE use and even PvP use is a major part of “Vanilla”
Mana users require them, rogues use them less but still, warriors use them less but still.
Each class has things it does well, and things it does like crap. Consumes are there for you to make up the difference if you select to do so.
Unused in raiding, but not in the overworld and dungeons which is what this utility you reference was actually, primarily designed for. Not saying PvP was not even 1% of the conversation, but its presence isn’t necessary to make sense of any class’s kit.
you say that and yet it clearly is NOT how it works in vanilla. It’s how you would LIKE things to work, for some reason. But the way it actually works is that warriors are not hybrids. Hybrids are druids, paladins, and shamans. That’s it. That’s all of em. Notice the similarities: they can fulfill all roles to some degree, including healing. Warriors cannot heal. They are not hybrids. It’s perfectly fine for them to dominate in dps, which by the way they can only do if they get really good gear. they are far more gear dependent than other classes
I did not. I said they should not be rotational. Those are emphatically and explicitly not the same thing. Being ready to use one or both on any given fight? Ok fine. Looking to use them the instant your mana pool can absorb the top-end of their possible restoration, so you can get the cooldown running because you are for sure going to be looking to use it again? Not fine.
Wrong/10chars
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It’s not how it works in the frankenpatch version of Vanilla we got in 2019. If you traveled back in time to Vanilla proper, warrior DPS was (for many reasons, from actual limitations of the class to ignorance about how to properly build it) laughable for most of the expansion’s run. Warriors are and always have been hybrids. It was accidental that warriors ended up scaling to the insane degree that they did, not some intended part of the game’s design.
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Thing is… That is how the game is designed.
You want something different obviously.
Why not play Wrath or Retail where you get that wish?
Era is here so we can enjoy it for what it is. SOM is basically Vanilla with a few exploits turned off.
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Game bug introduced in 1.11 in tandem with hyper optimized loot in 1.10 / 1.11 that enabled a very short window of opportunity in original Vanilla, and people make believe it was like this all along.
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Again with this erroneous assumption that the game was at it was intended, rather than it being positively fraught with design that failed to live up to its purpose. Vanilla was littered with failed and half-baked systems from beginning-to-end.
The vision the original developers had was truly remarkable and even failing to execute on it still made it 10x the game of everything that came before, but they absolutely did fail to execute on their vision in so many ways. I do not blame them because they are only human, but just like the warrior thing there are many systems that simply weren’t balanced properly even within the design philosophy that spawned them.
The devs knew that rage had a more drastic scaling curve than other resources, but they absolutely did not think it was going to be taken to the degree that it did. Consumables were there to use to be sure, but they didn’t put them in with the expectation that they would be getting used on-cooldown. Literally the original intent of quests was just to draw people to different areas where they assumed players would merrily grind away, and when they realized that players instead left in search of more quests when they were out in any given area they had to scramble to create a bunch more to fill in the gaps. The gaps that remained weren’t intended; they were just remnants of failed design. Not even failed design, but failed design that was itself the result of an emergency pivoting on their actual original design.
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Wait… what level range has a quest gap? I level basically only on questing and the mobs that die are those that are parts of the quests or that delay my way or aggro.
“im right and everyone else is wrong, fact”
-this draenai warrior
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Most modern players use routes that are incredibly optimized and manage to cover the gaps, patchwork-style, but for an average player in Vanilla there were usually multiple instances where you would end up with a dearth of them. Mid-30s and the 40’s have a lot of points where it’s easy to run out of things you can find to do if you don’t have the combined experience of everyone who already dealt with these issues over nearly 20 years.
This generally tends to be the case. Not always, but that is what happens when your north star is being as accurate as possible and you generally have a more orderly sense of facts and events that have happened than most people. I am human though, and a crucial part of becoming more accurate over time is both a willingness to admit when you are incorrect and a willingness to change your position based on new data.
I can still hear the voice of the devs on the DVD that came with my OG collector’s edition where they explain how much attention they paid to the ground textures being different in every zone to give them an immediately distinct feel. They compared the undead starting area to the human starting area (100% certain about the undead part, 98% certain on human part). They also talked about the sound and graphics that played when you leveled up, and how they wanted you to be having so much raw fun while you were playing that you were caught by surprise by dinging. They wanted this awesome combo of aesthetics to pop up and have you be like “Oh damn I leveled?!? Awesome!” Which, of course, is another example of a design they intended that they obviously did not nail the mark of. People are now and always have been keenly aware of their experience bar progress in Vanilla.
do you have any evidence for any of this stuff
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Ye lemme go track down articles that I haven’t seen for years because apparently I need hard evidence to counter you spewing nochanger bullhorse.
Evidence that you would swat aside regardless, like any time I have actually gone out of my way to do just that. “An article that emphatically proves that RDF was intended to be not just in Wrath, but even desired earlier?!? Don’t care! Onward with my bullheaded stance!” People like you lost the right to ask me for that a solid year ago, after proving over the previous two years that you were just going to move the goalposts or outright ignore actual evidence upon its presentation. My googlefu is good, but it still takes time.
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Warriors should be the top damage class , it fits the class and makes perfect sense
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lets say you do zero dungeons; there is still plenty here in terms of questing XP.
Just hit 60 2 days ago on my new pala; the following zones got me plenty of XP in that range, heck I had so many quests I skipped simply because it was outa the way / Know the drop rate is poop.
Arathi highlands, alterac mountains, tenaris, STV, badlands, feathermoon, ferallas,… I did like 1 quest in duskwallow marsh… (yes just 1)
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Mate I’m not talking about a modern player having a go at the game today. It was an incredibly common complaint from players in actual Vanilla, and if you dropped anyone new or newish into the game today without a guide they would have similar troubles.
A player that isn’t using a guide or who has a wealth of experience isn’t zigzagging across both continents efficiently like this.