New Book (Spoilers)

So I really take issue with the tactics employed by Alleria and Turalyon in trying to track down Sylvanas. I haven’t finished the book but i’m absolutely disgusted with the actions committed by Alleria on that poor orc mother and the smuggler. I can’t believe Turalyon was complicit and even helped in some of these encounters. Absolutely disgusting - purely evil actions.

I hope Alleria becomes a raid boss at some point - because what she did was just as bad as burning Teldrassil down if not worse - only on a smaller scale.


You are not alone in your disgust. I am a hordie though stated as Alliance in Vanilla. I love following the stories and I’m SOOOOOOO glad they added this in the book because everytime they give the Alliance something bad to do it’s always so lame or small or worse they say it wasn’t cannon cause it was only seen bad on the horde side. bla bla bla. For me (and only speaking for me so if you don’t agree that’s fine) What they did was horrible, disgusting, and downright immoral. The ends do not justify the means. Not in my book. And especially since there is an armistice in place. This downright goes against that. It’s war time tactics in a time when they are not at war.

Now i know they were told any means necessary but in my book you still have to go by morals. Or else you are NO better than the one you are going after. Torturing a mother in front of her child is a nightmare. Torturing anyone for information on someone else is a nightmare. It wasn’t their fault they crossed paths with the dark ranger. It wasn’t their fault if they were scared to death to talk about it. Come on…we all know what Sylvie and dark rangers did. If you were a lowly citizen would you risk it? Telling Alliance peeps who just came up in your face? I don’t think so. Doesn’t matter if they will heal. They were traumatized. The child was traumatized. ALl those seeing this were traumatized. It’s not a good thing…again…especially in time of an armistice.


Not really sure Alleria’s ‘enhanced interrogation’ techniques is really in the same ballpark as firebombing a civilain population center that’s already surrendered.

And I mean yeah the Lightforged are going full Lux Vult in the AU Draenor timeline, and the Velves are cozy with the concept of entropy gone sentient and homicidal. They’re going to be up to some shady ish and personally I’m thankful for it. Damn exhausting trying to fight the Alliance when all of their sins were caused by confusion, magical corruption or are retroactively justified.

Nice to see some actual depravity that could only be explained by an ‘ends justify the means’ mentality.

Also there’s some irony you’re complaining about torture while wearing a Scarlet Crusade tabard on your avatar.


I’d rather die than have a mental illness and whispers be forced into my head for the rest of my life. Especially because half of it because Alleria lacked the balls to put her mad sister to sleep.

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Seems like they’ll bounce back eventually from how it’s described. I mean yeah I’m sure they’re going to have some sort of weird PTSD from getting mind ducked. Probably terrifying to know your King employs agents who will tear any secret from your fractured psyche.

A Forsaken Apothecary got to be the voice of moral reason while historic champions of the Alliance tortured a terrified refugee in front of her shrieking toddler. Welcome to Morally Gray, have fun with it.


Exactly, I’ve lost all respect for Turalyon as well for condoning such actions, your supposed to be a paladin - a defender of the weak and you go and allow this to happen and then chain up the smuggler - Anduin even to an extent.

Have you seen all the stuff Paladins tend to do on a fairly regular basis?

Chaining someone up to get mentally torturued by the void seems fairly minor compared to what a Paladin can actually do with the Light.


Stormwind also apparently hangs thiefs in front of their children. Who appear to have turned to a life of crime out of poverty induced desperation.

Why are the Defias the baddies again? Comrade Van Cleef sounds more justified by the day.

Edit: Nevermind this was in Boralus. Forgot Fairweather was from there. Stormwind either kills you or gang presses you into assassination work.


Such as? I’m not aware of anyone outside of the Scarlet Crusade doing too much damage.

Just in here to agree with this.

Also, posting in a MHP thread. :popcorn:


Your right, I was puzzled by the defias issue. I mean, yes they committed some heinous acts, but clearly stormwind was wrong in the overarching plot.

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Pretty much the Scarlet Crusade making use of the Light to torture and kill everyone. Hell us players can use abilities like Crusader’s Strike and Wake of Ashes (new i know) to burn and cause terrible harm to people.

And just in general, Paladins doing evil things but as long as their conviction remains the Light still answers them means we get a lot of Paladins doing naughty things.


Again, i’ll say, i’d rather die than be tortured for the rest of my life by whispers and permanent mental illness and have my children witness it. Oh and can I even raise my children now?


My favorite is the Paladin slow that is described as burdening something with the weight of their sins.

But it’s usable on everything. Which has some pretty startling implications. What sins did the Barrens Zebra commit?


They wouldn’t be born with prison stripes on their bodies if they were innocent. :zebra:


Is the OP serious? I really can’t tell.

Did you forgot who Alleria and Turalyon were? The torture they used in the past? Sure it was during the Second War, so the stacks were high against demon blood crazed Orcs. Still, it is nothing new at all and it’s consistent with whom they were.

The thing that was weird to me was they could use Shadow and light together (or let’s say things like Lightforced being able to use voidportals).

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It could have something to do with the Stonemasons, which Van Cleef headed, killing Tiffin. I mean, not paying them for their work was completely wrong but, I mean, so was pegging a rock at Varian’s wife, who was in support of paying the Stonemasons for their work, and killing her. It’s the nobles fault for trying to cheap out Van Cleef and his workers, but at the same time, killing your King’s wife over a pay dispute is maybe a bit much.


i always love it when paladin figures in lore aren’t Boy Scouts since 1. it’s far more realistic and interesting and 2. it sends every HMP into a crying rage


Seems reasonable for the Stonemasons to do and like victim blaming.

I hate how at the end a big part of this and many other human gray events (Alterac) were simply made the Blackdragons fault.