It doesn’t change the fact that canonically all civilians were killed, so the writers went with the assumption that the Horde player would choose to kill them all.
It’s just the same as the invasion in cataclysm where civilians were targeted or the bombing of a school full of innocents and children in stonetalon.
Pretty sure it’s mentioned that those whisps come from the war of thorns.
And it still doesn’t change the fact that nobody in the Horde cared about Teldrassil. Nobody regret it, the rebellion happened because Sylvanas was acting for her own reasons instead of the good of the Horde.
Meanwhile those innocents are still all dead and have to suffer in the maw forever.
Now the Horde are “noble heroes” and “protectors of the living” after Teldrassil, which shows that the opinion of the writers is that killing Night Elves and sending them to hell, even if innocents is a good thing which then again shows their hatred towards the race.
So in other words: The Horde and Sylvanas are both innocent and Sylvanas will return to the Horde because the story going forward is treated like Teldrassil never happened.
Oh yea that makes sense for the civilians from Lor’danel
If it existed, it still exists on WoWHead. I invite you to find it.
Is not yet proven to be a fact to begin with. I certainly don’t remember it.
Probably is a nice qualifier.
Can you prove it?
That’s not true. The story is officially, as of whichever of the two books that came out, “the forsaken did it.”
Theramore was not a civilian settlement. They were specifically aiding and abetting Alliance military forces in the conquering of Horde Sovereign Territory.
You mean the bombing where even Garrosh “I want my tribe to die because daddy was evil” Hellscream yelled for us to hold the phone and the mayo, and killed the guy who did it?
I don’t think you thought this through.
Then I invite you to source it.
What. You’re insane. Even a little boy cared about the dumb tree more than I did.
And the forsaken belong to which faction again? And they are noble heroes and protectors of the living. Apparently the Night Elves don’t count as living because they only had like thousands of years to live peacefully if it wasn’t for the Horde.
No, I was talking about the Ashenvale invasion.
Yes I did, it’s still something the Horde did, and just before that Garrosh was killing innocent civilians too so that whole thing didn’t make sense to begin with. If you need proof, go to Silverwind Refuge in Ashenvale and look at the Night Elf corpses. Hint: They weren’t armed.
Nobody besides Saurfang did. Again the Horde was fine with Teldrassil itself, just not the fact that Sylvanas was acting entirely for her own.
So you just admitted that you don’t count night elf civilians as living people that shouldn’t be burned alive and sent to hell forever.
Thanks for making your intentions clear so that I don’t have to bother any further. Even I can say that innocent Horde civilians shouldn’t be targeted, but apparently you are just one of those that justify everything evil just because it’s against a race you don’t like - just like the writers.
It’s a mess to find this in Wowhead, but i found a post where a player was talking about it:
So death camps were a thing in the first build. I also clearly remember the outrage back then.
Useless to say that the civilans “saved” in Lor’danel were probably among them.
i said “probably” judging by how much whisps we saw in game, Astranaar was a village but not a big one maybe.
Remember that in reality, everything is bigger than what we have IG.
It’s something an insane general did, and was killed for. This is like blaming the Alliance for Staghelm.
No.
I stated that the Horde should be heroes.
They specifically state they don’t know what they’re talking about. This could be as simple as the time that night elf players saw “Slavering Laughing Maw” and thought it meant “people who enslaved” instead of “people who drooled.”
Which is why I asked you to prove it. I have no idea how large Astranaar is in canon and I doubt that you do, either. Any number you throw could be arbitrary.
Horde now, Horde previously. And Sylvanas will come back anyway it seems like since all of her crimes never happened in the eyes of the writers.
And the point that Garrosh did the same?
Should be, but burning innocents and children alive and sending them to hell doesn’t make you a hero, or protectors of the living. It makes you one of the most evil things in wow history, yet the writers call them heroes for doing it which is insulting for Night Elf fans.
Druid school wasn’t aiding and abetting Alliance forces in the invasion of Horde Sovereign Territory. The general just went nuts and wanted revenge. They aren’t the same act by any stretch of the imagination.
Is something Sylvanas is guilty for, not the Horde en total.
I give up at this point, are you aware that the words “probably” and “maybe” means a hypothesis, not a fact?
Also in my link, it was clear that they SAW the mention of death camps:
I believe the POW camp is still calling them up to be summarily executed. Plus, in an original build, Belmont was running a camp full of Kaldorei civilians, /yelling for them to be brought up and slain. Now he’s running a goblin drill.
There WAS a death camp for sure, now there MIGHT still be a death camp. Take it all with a grain of salt until live release - much like everything we’re debating about 8.1.
Yes. That’s exactly why I’m saying “put up or shut up.”
Alright, thank you. So we know that Belmont had a death camp on the PTR but did not in the launch – the very same launch that included saving night elf civilians.
Clearly, Blizzard realized they screwed up and dialed back a hefty amount. Though, not nearly enough given the end result.
Saurfang, the High Overlord of the Horde very clearly states civvies are being let go. Maybe Sylvanas intended to over rule him after. I don’t know. But let’s not pretend the entire Horde was gunning to kill civvies when we objectively know that’s not true.
I feel this has been done before but let’s do it anyway. I wasn’t aware Sylvanas singlehandedly slaughtered her way through 4 zones all the way to Teldrassil hauling all those siege weapons and fired them all on her own. That’s pretty impressive.
In both cases innocents and children were targeted, so I don’t see much of a difference.
Again, go to Silverwind Refuge.
Is something everyone that was involved is guilty for, and unfortunately that’s most of the Horde - all those that fought in the war of thorns and those that fired the catapults on a tree full of innocents.
That aside, Sylvanas will be redeemed anyway, now it’s more obvious than ever with Teldrassil not counting as a crime anymore.
Those who are in the Horde now and alright? Those who are noble protectors of the living? Those whose crimes have been whitewashed completely because after all, it was only Night Elves that were hurt and according to the writers nobody cares about?
No, why does it matter if you kill civilians in one of their towns or in a school? It’s no different, maybe explain why you think it’s different.
Yeah, yes.
You want Sylvanas to be redeemed because she did nothing wrong in your and the writers eyes, because she only ordered Night Elf civilians to be killed and tortured forever and apparently those don’t count as living people that are worth saving/sparing because they happen to be part of a race that seems generally disliked, even by the developers.
They don’t make raidbosses based on their appearance - and even if she was a raidboss, we see many examples of raidbosses that turn friendly once we defeat them. If Sylvanas happens to be one, that will be the case with her and I can’t wait to see you defend that Sylvanas redemption.
I wanted to write a long answer but then I saw those and realized that It’s better to not even bother with you since you have made your intentions clear anyway.
