And you don’t have the mental fortitude to predict how these same crybabies are going to be flooding the game with their complaints and tears the first time a random queue group bricks their personal key. And the development time wasted on bad ideas.
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I am specifically speaking about new alts where your mains score doesn’t show up. It can take a minute to put groups together or get into one with no score. The problem isn’t just “running” the 15 at 180, its getting people to que up that can do it, when you have no IO to show you can do it.
Your problem is thinking that a team of 5 randomly generated players with the right IO is going to time a key just because of their IO. It doesn’t work that way. While I agree that any dps, tank, or healer can comfortably time a 15, that doesn’t mean that you can just throw together any 5 classes.
All of this is meaningless though…you’ll never get a tank main to use it.
And now your system is going to cherry pick lusts and brezzes…so what’s the difference lol? If you’re worried about gating other players, your system does exactly that.
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Well there’s 2 or 3 GD folks who swear they’ll tank these. How many groups you think they can do per day?
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Hopefully thousands or the dps wait times will be around 4 days.
Queued content has a required completion rate from Blizzard metrics. Queued m+ would lead to dungeon nerfs. Hard pass. I dont want my content nerfed so paint licking mouth breathers can forehead smash their way through 15s, thanks.
MMR and random teams work for some games…like RTS, or even role emphasized FPS games…but not for content that was never meant to be pugged/randomized.
too many key elements go into forming a good mythic+ team, including role, class fantasy, the weekly affixes (and what abilities are best to defeating it), covenant choice, the dungeon, etc.
this was meant to be organized, well thought out and planned to successfully complete this content.
It would be so gamey feeling and messy if they had a random MMR type thing…plus LOTS of leaving. I would leave the instant I drew a group comp was horrible, and going to make the dungeon tedius.
And you’d be well within your right to do so. Why deny the option to those who would be willing to stick out the run to see how it goes rather than dropping because they didn’t like the color of the other player’s hair or their favorite class wasn’t included? This also presupposes that player-made groups don’t regularly fail, which we know simply isn’t the case. Sometimes the players don’t always know best.
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By your own admission, your solo que system is going to give special consideration to classes with brez, lust, and covenant. What’s the dps time going to look like for a warrior?
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This post has to be ironic right? I don’t think there should be matchmaking at all but low keys are a literal joke. If you think that you need a “group comp” to do a 15 then you’re just bad. Also that group wouldn’t even be bad at all. Fury Warrior is literally one of the strongest aoe melee in the game right now, Enhance can pump and it brings Windfury totem for the 3 Warriors + lust, and the priest has PI. If that was your idea of the “worst comp ever” then I’m not sure what to say to you.
That said I’ve seen the atrocities of lower keys while messing around on alts. TBH people that can’t do 15s at this point are the same people that play League and are stuck in Bronze and blame their teammates every game instead of improving themselves.
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well for those reasons - yeah it would be dumb. But that’s not the best example to illustrate my point. Imagine doing Sanguine Depths fortified and not drawing a venthyr…that’s going to fail lol, or be a lot harder than it could be if you just chose someone with the correct covenant.
What if you don’t draw a non-soothe class for a dungeon like DoS on Fortified, or a raging week. See what i mean? Or a disc priest healer on grievous…
also with the emphasis on having a good route, i don’t see why anyone thinks this mode would be fun to climb. players wouldn’t get to 20’s and i don’t think that’s fair to them.
His algorithm would be more exclusive than what currently exists.
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Covenants can be taken into account in the algorithm when the key is listed. The automated system would not deliberately pass over classes that don’t have things like lust or battle res the way many keyholders will now just sit with a list of 20 applicants waiting for just the right one before handing out an invite. If I were a class that didn’t have these things, I’d have greater faith in a properly tuned algorithm securing a spot for me (even accounting for inclusion of players who have these abilities) than taking my chances with a player that is operating on the basis of emotion. In the worst case scenario, you end up waiting just as long as you have to wait currently, but at least you get something out of your playtime other than a steady stream of rejections after staring at a dungeon list for an hour.
You’ve already said that it won’t create a group that doesn’t have those utilities. So if you’re a warrior or a rogue that isn’t the covenant for the dungeon you’re signing up for, just how long will your wait be? How many of that player’s own keys could be hosted and completed during that time?
If your plan is to stop gating players, why does your algorithm gate them?
That was an example but think storming as an affix in combination with all this…it would go very wrong very quickly.
The automated system would not need to be as rigid in its requirements as players currently are. I have been in groups without a battle res or lust that have finished high level keys without incident. Yes, there are certain weeks with certain affixes in certain dungeons that may be difficult if not impossible to complete without certain abilities, but these are the exception rather than the rule and can be accounted for if need be. The algorithm would not be without any sort of requirements but it would be far less demanding than players are in terms of what is or is not a viable comp in any given dungeon at any given time. Most players default to only wanting the easiest route to completion at all times. It’s what’s given rise to meta classes. An automated system has metrics for inclusion but it does not share the same human prejudices that shut out a sizable portion of the population. If you want the easiest route, you will still have that option. Players who are less demanding and willing to take a chance on less “viable” comps should have that choice.
That directly contradicts what you said before. So it will hold out for utility or it won’t? Because if it does, you’re not accomplishing what you set out to do. The “unfavorable” classes won’t be any better off.
I think you’re sort of overestimating this meta stuff…and especially now. Forum posters complaining about not getting into keys almost always have a lower IO than what is needed. It’s not because the guy is a warlock. It’s because he’s applying for 10’s when his highest timed is a 4.
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There is no contradiction here at all. The algorithm will attempt to include things like battle res and lust into each group if and when they are available. If a player without these abilities has been in the queue for a sufficient period of time, he or she will have priority at inclusion in the group formation over one who has just queued. In the current system, the warrior or rogue who has been applying to groups for an hour and a half and being rejected by each one has just had his time wasted because the keyholders don’t know and don’t care how long he’s been trying to get into a group. He has a diminished chance at getting his keys done in this system because his time is not valued in this system.
The meta complaints have died down because the game is currently in a lull and more people have either reached their mythic+ goals for the season or given up after not getting into groups. It was (and still is) very difficult to get into higher keys without out-gearing or out-scoring them considerably. Indirectly, this is tied to class: The warlock may not be getting directly rejected because he is a warlock, but because he can’t get into any groups to get the requisite experience and gear, he is caught in a vicious circle whereby in order to get into groups, he must out-score and out-gear them, but he can’t get the experience and gear because nobody will invite him. And this isn’t the case of a 4 getting into a 10. It’s also prevalent with people who’ve done all 14’s and can’t get an invite to a 15, etc.
Then it will also attempt to exclude those that don’t have them. While they’re sitting in que for 9 days, maybe host a few of their own keys?
You can’t reason with this person. The m+ queue idea is full of altruism, and I understand what it is trying to accomplish, but it just fundamentally wouldn’t work. Trying to argue against altruism isn’t gonna get you anywhere, no matter how many holes you punch in the logic.