MT is the end of Blizz

If you want a brawler’s guild, why not go to the brawler’s guild? MT was made with CDs, really everything in your toolkit, to perfect it.

Casuals get the Mage Tower as well.

The game has a serious lack of difficult content that isn’t walled behind gear and social requirements. All those things you listed need a consistent team to get, or the gear from other sources of content which requires a consistent team.

But the Mage Tower? The Mage Tower is true casual content.

It ticks all the boxes for casual content, providing an evergreen goal that can be worked on for as long as they’d like, it doesn’t require you to schedule blocks of your time, if it’s up you can put in as much (or as little) time as you’d like and any of the best gear for it can be gotten completely solo.

The only caveat? It’s pretty hard. But easy content is not inherently casual, and casual content should not be inherently easy.

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Partly true, but only partly.
When I was younger I completed Myst IV, which was hellishly hard. I “worked” on it for months. And it could easily labeled as casual.
But the problem with the current incarnation of MT is not that it is hard. The problem is that it is bait and switch, annoys a lot of people and further damages Blizzard’s reputation in a moment Blizzard should do anything to REGAIN rep. Because, currently Ve’nari has you at Sell You to Zovaal trust level, Blizz. Sorry, but the truth.

I think that’s a pretty uncommon stance from people who are unhappy with the current iteration.

How so? I’d genuinely like you to elaborate here.

Where was the bait and where was the switch?

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I have a feeling people are hating the MT for the sake of hating it and different people have a different take. Or they’re arguing in bad faith. Like the people complaining you can’t overgear it while demanding legion trinkets be nerfed. Bro, why :skull: literally shooting yourself in the foot.

I am not personally unhappy about MT. I ignore it, just the way I did with the original version after just one (1) try. I said “Ok, Blizz, I am too old for this… nonsense” and carried on.

But I see what’s happening. As other people already observed, in PTR MT was tuned way lower, so people got hyped. Then released much harder, so “engagement metrics” or what the heck they are named will get a very temporary boost. Or, even more probably, just to spite players.

That Blizz could wilfully spite their customers in SUCH A SITUATION is astonishing, but never forget that they are those who gave Alliance mechagnomes while they were Horde the vulpera.

Sonebody talked of “rockstar” mentality. But why? Real rockstars are usually WAY more careful in their behaviour, particularly those with their fans.

P.S.
I think by now I owe at least one pint of good ale to good ol’ Danny Glover. :heart_eyes:

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PTR content is often significantly undertuned though. Blizzard are more interested in making sure the fight works over making sure the fight is hard.

I don’t see how that’s a bait and switch so much as people not understanding how PTR tuning works.

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That’s not necessarily done out of malice. Blizzard’s intent could have been to have people go through different stages of MT for bug testing. They do it all the time.

I am still convinced that particularly in this situation they should be less arrogant and more pragmatic. People was expecting the rebirth of the Legion MT. Nobody warned them that it would be substantially harder. PTR, whatever the reason, reinforced the idea that it would be more or less like the previous MT. People resubbed for that.

The correct policy would have been: “See, people have wanted challenging solo content for a while. So we are releasing a modified MT expressly to meet that wish. But be warned, it’s intended as REALLY challenging, even more than original MT.”

But then fewer people would have resubbed for that. And never miss a chance to spite your players, innit?

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When first introduced in Legion, the Mage Tower challenged players to conquer unique solo class-specific encounters. Legion Timewalking brings back the excitement with all-new rewards to obtain, and a chance to prove your tenacity. Are you a master of your class? It's time to put your knowledge and skill to the test once more!

I dunno bout you, but telling people to prove their tenacity and asking people if they’re masters of their class doesn’t strike me as an “in and out 20 minute adventure” kind of deal.

I feel like a significant amount of anger at the MT comes from people making assumptions and then getting mad when those assumptions weren’t true.

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That presentation seems to promise something like the original MT, not an overtuned version. I repeat, no problem with that (I would not play it anyway), as soon as it’s correctly advertised.

But now, I will follow Danny’s golden advice, so bye bye.

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No, it just promises a challenge and asks you to test your skills.

But if we look at this specific wording.

When first introduced in Legion, the Mage Tower challenged players to conquer unique solo class-specific encounters.

When first introduced.

When it was first introduced, MT was incredibly hard. Like really, really hard. People are basing their assumptions on the difficulty of the tail-end of the expansion, where maxed out artifacts and Antorus gear made it a joke.

Those assumptions were wrong.

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As I said, bye. Muting the thread.

I disagree. While true the tower is “accessible” to anyone, double and tripling the HP values of bosses(Xyxlem, Raest, etc…) while not adjusting the ability timers makes the DPS requirements too high.

Like I said, during Legion, even in Nighthold, God Queen Fury was relatively lax on the DPS needed to beat the enrage. Do mechanics, win. Now if you aren’t doing Mythic raid orange/pink parse levels of damage, you will hit the enrage, even if doing the mechanics. Which is vastly different than Legion. Reducing the health of these bosses in particular by 10-15% does not in any way trivialize the encounter. But it does lessen the DPS threshold needed, though even then it’d still be tuned tighter than Legion.

A goal that once this event is over can be attempted for two weeks out of the whole year. A lot of casuals don’t play the game more than maybe an hour or two here or there. Then you consider a lot of higher end players, even some streamers and youtubers beating their heads against a wall for 5-10 hours trying to figure out these challenges and ways to overcome the shoddy tuning. That definitely screams casual friendly content. Not really, no, it doesn’t.

Once again, the crux. It should absolutely be a challenge, I haven’t once denied that, however, due to the changes to classes and the way Blizzard tuned this iteration, it is undeniably harder than the original during Tomb of Sargeras. Which…again, when the original Mage Tower was balanced to be difficult at X level, then they massively buff the Timewalking version to exceed that difficulty, it’s not cool.

I don’t care what Blizzard thinks, I don’t care if you or Bob or Jill thinks this current version is fine. I wholeheartedly feel however, that Timewalking content should not exceed its predecessors difficulty. And outside of Agatha for Fury and Kruul for Vengeance, the rest absolutely have.

(Note, just because I say I don’t care, I do care and respect your opinion, I just disagree.)

Limited time content can be reasonably challenging, and the game definitely needs harder content for solo players, regardless of skill levels. But given the base reward is just a recolor, it should be tuned to be more reasonable to the masses, not tuned this high in difficulty. It can be challenging without being frustrating. And it can also be nerfed to that level without making it trivial.

Edit.

What? Every single PTR I’ve been part of, everything has been tuned harder than it is on release. Hell I remember Legion normal dungeons being insanely hard, lol. But PTR’s generally also have multiple test cycles. With the Mage Tower we didn’t even get a full day, before they massively buffed it without testing it, thus having no way of knowing if it’d still work and how the difficulty would feel.

People who test the PTR are also typically higher caliber players and not representative of the playerbase as a whole.

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How do you practice for content you can’t zone into ?

Nah I’m sure there’s still years’ worth of anger, frustration and depression to be extracted from the players.

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All that you want during the one week it’s active every six months.

You DO realize there is no seasonal brawler’s guild in SL right?

Yeah, Ive had some good friends in my guild just rage quit and go on break because they got frustrated. That’s NOT the reaction content should have.

And they aren’t bad players. They clear 22/23 keys with their group.

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So ask for one, don’t ask to nerf MT to be one.