Again, then tell them to run Serpentstalker. Tell them to use the weaker legendary instead of using the legendary that has 10% more potential while telling them to use it at 60% efficiency.
At least now i know why youre misinformed.
That guide is simply wrong/outdated. The way it is written it seems to assume that Aimeds who proc Trickshots dont consume the buff themselfes. Also, check out the “last edited”, its from february, before the patch was released.
Icy Veins is generally a good and up to date guide. You might also want to cross reference this with actual logs. There is no good log that alternates shots.
I do this with my own logs. Oh wow, my math is correct! I don’t care about guides, I know how to use raidbots and excel too. I knew necro was going to be the best mm covenant for output in M+ for months because they all used the covenant legendary to begin with and the kyrian legendary was and still is trash.
My own logs alternate shots. Here’s one from tonight. I kept up with the warlock and then some. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/nykAYgVPma37p2Bb/#fight=last&playermetric=dps Want to show me your amazing min maxxed 26 logs?
Your math?? Please stop it. You dont do any math, its getting more ridiculous every time.
From your own log: Your average cast of Multi did 13,2k damage, your average cast of Aimed did 53,7k damage. How on earth can you justify losing Aimeds just to cast more Multis? Where is your math on that?
Youre doing 23s, so you cant be a completely terrible player, but even under Trueshot youre alternating?? That is just terrible gameplay. You could do so much better if your basics would be right.
But its not. And before you want to link Warcraftlogs that shows NL a tiny bit ahead of Kyrian, thats heavily skewed by lowlevel dungeons where the packs are dead after the bombs go off and any Kyrian cant get any value of their area-bound ability.
This is not a debate about who is a better player, but about what is the best way to maximise your damage. Its unlikely that anything you or i do in a singular log is going to impact this discussion. But if you still want to have at it: My main is Aldrathor-Eredar.
Because those Aimed Shots you are talking about DO NOT EXIST. There is no charge available. Multi is the next best thing because not only does it do a little bit of damage with precise shots, but spending that focus gets you more shots at a free reload. Sure, Theoretically you could plop down volley and get 7 buffed aimed shots. But how in the world are you going to stand still for 7 aimed shots in a key?
Just check out the very first pull. Its with Trueshot and there are 8 Aimeds and 2 RF as the first casts. Not a single MS or Arcane in that sequence. This is insanely more dps than if i had alternated my shots there. You are losing out massively with your playstyle. I know youre dug in your trenches now and its very unlikely that any kind of evidence can convince you at this point, but you should really look into this, because youre losing a lot of damage.
Here, I see three failed casts, presumably because you had to move, and something that can happen 1/16th of the time. Of course you wouldn’t need to alternate during volley, that’s the main benefit of the volley talent. But you could and the rotation’s less clunky, you can move when a mechanic is less than a global away from hitting you, and you wouldn’t risk running out of focus/charges because you didn’t get lucky with vigil procs.
I see how it could be useful in a level 16 dungeon where packs die in 10 seconds. But for the long term, more consistent profile which you’ll need as your tank chain pulls 10+ mobs at any given time, you might consider that trick shots is capped at 6 and multi shot is uncapped, and that you’ll need to still be doing good damage after your burst is over.
There is only one interrupted cast and with how much more damage Aimed does, i could have interrupted 3 and still done more damage than i had done with alternating. But i knew i shouldnt have used one of my own logs since i pretty much just do the necessary dungeons at this point.
And surprise, surprise, its pretty much the same thing on the very first pull.
What you are now trying to say (moving goal posts again) about movement is just distraction. Of course you can move less freely while casting Aimeds, duh. However, this was not your point. You wanted to alternate the shots every time, not just when you have to move.
Your little slight with the 16 dungeons should be busted with above log and lets look into your claim about Multi being uncapped. In the above log, an average cast from Aimed did 63,3k damage, while the average MS cast did 21,4k. Aimed in this case is even dragged down by single target casts during boss fights. There is no reasonable pull in a dungeon where MS would do even close to the damage of an Aimed, it would probably have to be around 40+ mobs.
This isn’t really up for debate. If you have 5 focus or more (can be tracked via weakaura), using Aimed Shot will spend 35 focus, go over the 40 focus threshold, and trigger and be buffed by Trick Shots. Then it’s a 50% chance for a free Aimed Shot charge from that. It’s far more damage than a buffed Arcane Shot. The only time to use Arcane Shot or Multi Shot is if your next Aimed Shot will not proc Trick Shots or if you have no Aimed Shot charge and you need to force Trick Shots. Or perhaps during heavy movement.
The Icy-Veins guide is largely considered by the community to be the superior option when it comes to hunter guides.
Here’s what it says about 4 set:
With the 4PC Tier Set Bonus, you should ignore Precise Shots and focus on maximizing Aimed Shot casts.
You could also go run a simulation and look at what the sample ability usage looks like. People have spent a lot of time optimising the APL to yield the highest number possible and that’s pretty much all the math being done for you, no need for a napkin.
But all of this is getting beyond the original point of this thread. There is no actual way to track the focus counter in game so we’re left guessing. And with the fact that said counter resets almost seemingly randomly as there is no consistency in what does or does not, this can lead to desynchronisation. The concern has been voiced by Jayeasy, the author of the tracking WeakAura, in the set bonus thread.
On massive trash like De Other Side and Halls of Atonement, I think it’s better to stick with Surging Shots Legendary with Double Tap/Rapid Fire with or without 4P. With less trash, Vigil could be better with 4P.
I will deal with 4P procs monitoring when I get my 4P next week.
The auras simply don’t reflect the true focus counting because of the reset logic which has not been disclosed by Blizzard yet (even though only one from the WA website seems to be working more precisely).
Spot on. You are on the same page as I’m. Focus tracking is simply mandatory for this legendary. Blizzard has to present us with the logic for when focus gets reset so we can start adapting our Weak Auras to the in-game counting.
I partially agree with you. You advice makes it simple to play. But playing like that, at some point, you might still be caught off guard by not having spent enough focus to cross the 40 focus barrier (even worse if you’re not tracking focus in real time). This leads to a gameplay very far from the class’ full potential.
Casting Arcane/Multi/Kill Shots (like you said) unnecessarily after an Aimed Shot loses the whole point of having the 4pc Tier Set. That’s where you might be misinterpreting it. The main reason for keeping track of focus is to NOT DO what you’ve just said about overcasting Arcane/Multi shots after an Aimed Shot. It it to avoid casting Arcane/Multi Shots when you can otherwise cast Aimed Shot which will benefit from the upcoming Trick Shot buff (resulting in +30% damage).
So basically we do have to keep track of focus. By doing so, we might easily increase our output damage by a considerable amount. That’s for sure.
I don’t disagree, I know how the set bonus works and it’s not optimal, but it’s still pretty good and very easy to play. You shouldn’t be casting any unempowered aimed shots this way, which would be a much more significant loss to your dps.
If you have trick shots up already, and you can see this by making a quick weakaura, you should just use your aimed shot if it’s there. But in general, alternating, especially outside of your burst, is fine and managable for most players.
That’s the problem: Weak Aura is still not tracking it precisely. There are points in dungeon which lead to an in-game focus reset (which is not presented to us via the Weak aura). Consequently, you might start you fight thinking you got enough focus to cross the 40 focus threshold (in order to get Trick Shots) when you actually haven’t got enough. This messes up with your count for all your subsequent shots thus leading to an inefficient gameplay.
Respectfully I’m pretty sure you don’t know how 4 piece plus vigil works or you wouldn’t be alternating. It’s literally not how the spec works.
Rather than arguing, walk up to a cleave dummy and cast two aimed shots in a row. Or three. Four even.
While you have to cast Arcane/Multi sometimes when you don’t get a Vigil proc, that’s not the same thing as “alternating”. It’s common to string together 5-6 Aimed shots in a row.
You are giving very bad advice/info and FWIW leaving a lot of damage on the table. The correct guide very clearly states to ignore Precise Shots w/ 4 piece + Vigil.
I honestly thought I would be God’s gift to the meters when I swapped to MM 4pc, but I do better as BM, especially on movement fights. MM just smokes BM at AoE. When I play MM, aimed shot resets so often that I have trouble casting anything else, so moving tanks my DPS. I miss the old style where you actually get to use all of your abilities instead of just spamming aimed shot.
You want pretty much all of your Aimed casts to be empowered.
If you cast an Aimed that pushes the focus counter over the 40-threshhold, it will immediately trigger Trickshots and consume it, so you dont have to have Trickshots active when you start the Aimed cast.
As long as you have charges of Aimeds, you only want to cast an Arcane if your counter is at 0 focus, at all other times a casted Aimed will be buffed by Trickshots.
