Mage Tower = Metrics Tower

I achieved all the challenge skins for the classes I played (DK, DH, Palli) back during the ToS raid tier before the first round of nerfs, and prior to Argus in September of 2017.

During Legion I can say with clear certainty that the mage tower was indeed challenging, with the Paladin PROT skin alone taking me at least 50 attempts to get (it was the hardest tank challenge of the day). There was a real sense of clear progression in the challenge (very different to the 9.15), in that once you overcame one hurdle, you were mostly able to navigate it again in lead up to the next one. Each progressive stage in the challenge was to some degree punishing, but gave you a decent margin for errors, to consistently get up to the stage where you failed and continue to master the oncoming mechanic whilst developing the muscle memory and stress management of the encounter.

Following a successful completion of the Prot Paladin challenge, I was able to complete my other toons challenge skins for tanking within 10 pulls of each attempt being that the mechanics were more or less very similar (of course each tank challenge was slightly different). This is important as it implies a balance of the challenge and the transferability of skillset.

9.15 Live Mage Tower though?

IF you look at vintage footage of the Mage Tower Challenges during Legion in the ToS raid tier and compare the rate of dropping health, progress, and time to the 9.15 PTR, they are more in line with each other. If you however compare that vintage footage with the 9.15 live version, its glaringly obvious that something is very IMBA.

Why did Blizzard clearly OVERTUNE everything at the last minute?
It wasn’t something spontaneous and has to do with choosing business metrics over community engagement.


Challenge and Elitism are very different things.

Challenge infers that a situation/encounter will be difficult, but you can continually grow at a reasonable pace and get eventually succeed. An example of challenging is getting your Keystone Master. On average in a season, the percentage of players that achieve KSM is approx. 14% of the total player base. This falls into the category of “challenging” as on average more than 85% of people don’t achieve it and comes closer to the life/age old 80/20 rule.

Now, beyond challenge is elite. One would classify elite in WOW as the seasonal Gladiator title where only 0.5% attain it (interestingly the Challenger PVP title is attainable by 35% of all players – just consider this). The Gladiator title implies that you have well and truly gotgud at the game and sit apart from all others. This is great for those players, but this kind of content is not what most participants play a game for.


When Blizzard does a general promotion of content, it is implied that it will cater to and is something that most of the community will be able to participate and succeed in. For example, the promotion of new dungeons, raids, and world zones that take centre stage in a patch or expansion. They’ve always done this.

What they don’t put as much emphasis into is going through Gladiator or KSM rewards (separate threads to their active promotion) because these don’t generally apply to most of the player base as something, they are likely to attain. Why is the above relevant?

The Mage tower has been the front and centrepiece of 9.15. It is the “carrot” they were waving in front of a waning player base to try to get them to return and/or stay. To heavily promote a feature that presently tuned fits more into the category of elite, is a gross misstep in judgment and misleading. IF you don’t intend for a reasonable amount of people to succeed in the challenge (especially since this is not the first time you’ve implemented this), don’t make it the centrepiece of everyone’s attention. It’s deceitful marketing.


The release of the Mage tower for December is not a coincidence. It is effectively the end of the US financial year, and final reporting quarter of 2021 where organisations go all out to make their books and numbers “look good”.

When sales (subscriptions) are falling, or dismal and corporate players need to justify their pay/division/business case/bonus and one of the tools abused most is metrics of usage and engagement. It implies that If product “engagement” is up, then by extension should lead to further sales revenue. In a gaming software environment, however, it isn’t difficult to create “engagement” as you control the content.

For example, if you want to force people to “engage” with the game, you can implement systems that a player MUST participate in (seem familiar?) if they want to generally progress, otherwise, the core end game (which can be awesome) is not something players can equally participate in. The implemented systems aren’t required in any way necessary or integral to the core gameplay, they can just be an artificial layer of requirement.

Further, beyond this, you can compound systems upon systems to create crazy time syncs that forces participants who are largely invested, to commit more and more time to inflate “engagement”. In a gaming sense, this more likely equates to player fatigue than further revenue, but the lead developers know that they grey hairs aren’t aware of this since it has a different nuance in software to conventional products.

The result of the above is developers and game designers that are creating content to artificially pump “engagement” time loops to justify jobs, pay rises from their governance at the expense of those players who are supporting them with the $$$ (Think of any ineffective government), instead of doing the job of creating genuinely enjoyable and engaging experiences. When this becomes the paradigm for a gaming studio, inevitably something gives (and has very much so with the decline from more than 15 million active subs to allegedly less than 2 million).

This is unfortunately what most commonly happens when a company becomes big corporate listed. The internal operations become rife with metrics and justifications for positions and budgets all the way up the chain, making it about the menial tasks and politics instead of the first principles of making great products that consumers will want and support. Simply put, they’re out of touch because they’ve forgotten real hunger and the fundamental work that is required to put a meal up.


I’ve highlighted the first 3 main factors in hope of shedding insight into how we, the player base community are knowingly being manipulated and treated as hamsters on a wheel (an unsatisfying one at that).

Like all populations, there are those who love running on that wheel and excel at it, and that’s great for them. However, most of us aren’t interested in being them and paying with time and real money to be placed on this process of structurally decaying tuning and polishing their products for them. We’re tired of being in the loop of wilful over tunning in knowing inevitable anticipation of community backlash and re-tunning to drag out content life cycles.

What this current live Mage Tower experience highlights as a spectator and participant is that:

  • Blizzard are still not genuinely ready to listen to their community
  • Blizzard doesn’t genuinely care about the player experience or community
  • Game systems implemented are philosophically designed for the purpose of time syncs to satisfy developer “engagement” metrics in lieu of meaningful game design

The same way as always. Blizzard could have listened to feedback during the PTR which is and had always been provided by veterans and advocates of their products, instead of always doing the “YEAH NAH, we’re going to take it in this direction”, only inevitably to U-TURN later when player fatigue reaches its limits to tell us “we’re listening now”.

With the ever-declining numbers, Blizzard needs to understand that generally the community is wise to their false/fake empathy loops and to just focus on making good gaming experiences.

I sure hope so! Unfortunately, too much of what Blizzard has done points to otherwise as decisions are left up to/made by those that hand out the paycheques/bonuses and those who receive them no longer have the backbone anymore to stand up and say, “I think that’s a terrible business decision”.

In the end/conclusion REAL change in the form of making appropriately tuned and enjoyably engaging content is what Blizzard need to refocus on, not PR management, delaying tactics or metric accumulation.

PS. To all the Blizzard fanboys and elites that will inevitably give their feedback, I’m genuinely glad for and envious you still enjoy and are fulfilled by this game, and I hope it continues for you. But how many of you would it require to keep the franchise going, and are there enough of you to do it?


Is this your College Thesis? Oh wait, that would have been less words.

Anywho, everything you are saying is, well, just your opinion man.


The stellar WoW community folks.


this post is 100000% facts


For other content maybe
But this will dissaper in 2 weeks , makes no sense to make it super hard or super easy if all they want is engaging
If is it super easy, casual players will do it in the first try and is done
If is super hard, casual players will give up in the first try and is done

This game started failing when they lost sight of creation of content and just started coming up with random ideas. Like boss fights started out simple, though not too intelligently thought out - but they worked. Then they got more and more complex while losing the intelligence completely. Like the bossfight in hellfire citadel where the guy says “I’ve feasted on a thousand souls. Yours will be next!!” …that’s not exactly entertaining. The fight just doesn’t have physics, style, or much of any entertainment value. Compare that to Arthus - dude has valkyries that pick you up, ghouls that spawn, reasonable abilities for his character… the fight just has intelligence in the design.

While we can all try to pick away at this game and try to tell them how it should be done – we’re all kind of missing mark. We’re not creating a creative environment and that’s one of the biggest killers to this game!!! Someone posts an idea and it gets shot down immediately without any logic, without any reason – other than just to follow the status quo as if the complainer knows better than the person who came up with an idea.

The community is trash in this game. The devs… I wouldn’t blame all of them, but I just knew whoever was in charge of the content creation needed to be fired – roughly towards the end of Wrath because they came up with a flying dragon… that was sleeping underground… that spawned tenticles on it’s back.


Now though, this game is catered to elitist prks who treat people as if they’re lesser people who don’t deserve to be invited to raids (and I’ve seen elitist raids fail often,)… but PvP in Shadowlands is given to classes, not players. I saw a video of a guy who got gladiator title just buy setting up convoke and meteor… 2 broken abilities got them gladiator, not talent.

Mythic + dungeon groups in lfg … yall are trash human beings man. You deny people who qualify for your dungeons based on raider IO… and when you fail, some of you leave the group so they can’t finish the dungeon. This community lacks integrity. That plus those clown devs that fired… that has been this games downfall. And I’ll admit, I don’t like some of the people who are still devs. I just hear nonsense + ego pouring from their face when they talk. That’s not gonna do it… that attitude serves self, not creative design.


Also, if they only want engaging making things easy would be better, look at warfronts, those were super easy and the rewards were very good and it has a lot of participation, but the content creators didn’t stop complaing about it to the point they stop doing it.

I just think the devs are listening to the wrong people

Feel free to start your own group if you aren’t capable of dealing with pugs. It’s no wonder people don’t stay in your groups. My god you’re salty and have a horrible demeanor.


They would try it then do another.

And feel like they were misled and resubbed on false premises. So the game is worse off than before because some of those people will never come back.

Whatever their goal, they bungled this one badly.

Wall of Texts crits me for dead.

All jokes aside, The MT was on the PTR for all of ONE DAY, UNO, ONE, #1. Not much there for feedback, then last minute buff it for no reason other than to maybe set everyone off.

I think this is a question that deserves an answer.

Why push out last minute untested balance changes?

My theory with these type of things is there’s an upper management overwhelmingly guided by a principle that if we feel like we’ve completed our goals we will unsub. And at the last minute they run the numbers on things and always decide it doesn’t take enough time.

Sometimes they have a good knob they can turn to adjust this, like say making a domination gem require more currency to level, and sometimes it’s just a clumsy stab in the dark.

In the end I think it comes down to this. They don’t want to spend the time and money to produce content at a pace where they wouldn’t need to do these things. So we’re getting ever increasing and desperate schemes to stretch the shelf life of the content they do manage to get out the door.

In this case though.

They owe an apology to all the people that beat their heads into a wall hour after frustrating hour trying to complete their fools errand.


Well the old videos are probably people that had hundreds of attempts. They had everything figured out to beat the challenge. They don’t show the failed attempts or time it took to get the gear.

I gave up 3 goes in I competed it in legion and quickly realised it’s not possible as a holy priest for me in tinewalking. I’d like to see any holy priest that can do it bar some world number one rated, wasn’t even worth my time with how overturned it is.


And they want to introduce a new language component in the new map coming haha, I am so tired of the useless currencies and systems.


Can you guys just remember the “T” in PTR stands for test. It was under tuned to debug the mechanics and other aspects of the event.

And so ya know…


212 posts

Community Manager00


Hello everyone! Thank you so much for your ongoing feedback about the Mage Tower.

We are currently evaluating the data regarding Mage Tower success rates, and we have identified that some of the challenges for certain specializations are more difficult than intended. We will return once we have more information to provide on what changes we have planned to bring those specializations more in line with the rest.

The game manager is the GM of elitist jerks. That says everything you need to know about how they look down on us plebs.

1 Like

do yall see what I’m talking about about a toxic community? Hate already over what? Did what I say offend you Diandria? Does the truth hurt? lmao… you’re so toxic Diandria, I’m just speaking to the group of people who shun the majority of players because it “suits them…” You’re the reason the game isn’t fun.