Incoming DWelknarr wall of text!!!
Hypocrisy thy name is vu
Do we get a fun lava drain when a dungeon has branches you return to? Like in Stonevault
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People that arenât even here to make the game better, just here to try and win online arguments for dopamine. Itâs wild and sad.
It has to be thematic. Black blood fills the dungeon instead
Ironic that you replied to someone doing exactly that 
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Your comment wastes space and clutters the discussion.
U2 /10char
On topic of improving m+ I saw this thread the other day.
Tldr:
Give keys 2-3 charges so player can have some attempts / mitigate against single mistakes bricking keys.
Have keys work in 2 dungeons at a time to increase variety and options.
Have nascent / enchanted crests be usable to increase items upgrade tracks. This is a heavy currency investment that would require killing that boss on that difficulty or earning X score in the case of m+ as well.
Rework champions peril
Revert the cc change
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We have spent literal hours going back and forth with responses every few minutes on M+ topics in the pastâŚ
Or have Arthas chase you and will basically 1-shot you if he reaches the party. Oh wait, they already did thatâŚ
Yes it does. It forces teams to prioritize limited resources due to not having unlimited time. Otherwise, the only thing that matters is can you kill the boss or not, just like what exists for raid.
You may not like that purpose, but it is a purpose.
The only keys that are pulled anything with even a passing resemblance to current normal dungeons are ones that are significantly below your teamâs level. Coordinated groups might pull 4-5 packs together with strategic cooldown use, but that is the absolute limit on a key that is challenging for the group.
Can you find a single quote of someone saying MMO dungeons require a timer to be challenging? Me saying M+ was designed with a timer in mind and that it wouldnât be the same if the timer were removed is unequivocally not the same as saying no dungeon could ever be designed that is challenging without a timer.
This is an opinion. Youâre welcome to have that opinion, but Iâm not going to stop doing something I find fun because you donât.
For someone who claimed they werenât going to respond to me again and unsubbed, youâre doing a pretty terrible jobâŚ
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Fyi shrodingers toxicity doesnt mean what you think it means. Shrodingers toxicity is a company that uses computional tools to predict drug toxicity. So nice try, trying to sound smart
or I am making a silly joke.
a statement is both toxic and non toxic depending on who said it
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I hate the cc change. That decision could potentially have worked okay had they made it much earlier in development.
Since this season is void themed they could make it so our characters are being driven insane and we need to clear the dungeon before that happens.
Maybe have our screen slowly have black creep in from the edges to the center where it goes fully dark when time is up (then clears so people can finish).
Imagine how thematic that would be!
Your use of âSchrĂśdingerâs Toxicityâ is a bit of a stretch. My actions remain consistent regardless of who performs them; what matters is the intent and context behind the behavior. Just because two people do similar things doesnât automatically make the impact or intent identical. Labeling something âtoxicâ requires more than just copying an actionâit requires understanding the circumstances and motivations behind it. Letâs not reduce the discussion to catchphrases but focus on the context that differentiates toxic behavior from acceptable interaction
All instances should have the delve interface period. And before anyone @s me, I know why keys need to deplete and be random, but letâs be honest, no one is truly forced to run keys they donât want to.
Welcome to S3 of DF.
I wish blizzard would just give in already and bring out a classic version of wow for those players. Man that would be awesome.
You are making quite a few assumptions here and I think they are alllargely false.
Perhaps but there are also a ton of players that do care about the ladder in some way, shape, or form. You know back in the day what made me want to play wow was seeing a tank in the full onslaught gear with bulwark of azengoth. I wanted to be that guy. What I didnât know was the amount of work and effort it would take to be that guy. Now days everything is a transmog, all items can be upgraded to mythic even if you havenât step foot into mythic raid which is fine. However io, rankings, wow logs etc give the player that ability to have that. Even me a semi average player likes to see that in my server in in the top 10 as far as keys and io go.
Really where? Everyone plays competitively do some degree. Not everyone participates in race to world first, nor being the number 1 letâs say monk in the world. But a large portion of the player base is competitive. As a human we want to be challenged and work hard to be better than others.
Because their numbers are more than you think they are. You have 3 player groups. Casuals, semi-hardcore, and hardcore.
The casuals donât typically get their 8 vaults done a week. Due to time, skill, etc or all of the above. If blizzards goals is to entertain this group of players then they need to give them content to keep them entertained I.E. delves. I feel like this is a semi small group, mainly because not everything blizzard does is tailored to this group
Semi-Hardcore players typically get their 8 vault slots a week. But the vault might have 1-2 mythic slots and last one is heroic. Delve slots might not be filled. And half if not all raid slots are filled. Personally I feel this is where most the player base sits.
Hardcore players fill their vaults slots with 8 mythic slots, run 8-8 delves, and have at min. All raid heroic slots filled. I personally fill like I belong to this group. I donât think this is a small group I think itâs more than the casual group but less than the semi-hardcore group.
I think blizzard has put them into a tough spot where they are trying to decide who to tailor too and giving the wrong impression to the player base on the direction they are going. Which for the player base means no group of players is going to get what they want.
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I enjoy M+. Iâve made it my goal and have achieved KSM and 2500+ rating since season 2 SL and portals for all majority of the dungeons since S4 SL. I know people push higher than that but for me, thatâs enough.
Anyway, I do agree that M+ needs some kind of hard reset. As it is, offering your key up either in a pug or guild group can be a risk/reward. More times than not, especially this season, itâs a huge risk. Tank nerfs/healer nerfs/+15 sec death timer. Keys break on a pull or 2 and itâs GG.
I enjoyed the old challenge mode concept. The precursor to modern M+. Bronze/silver/gold. Keep it simple. I achieved gold on all MoP and WoD dungeons and it took me several xpacs to get into M+. I think thatâs all we really need again. Balancing all these dungeons and classes to be competitive is a consistent nightmare. In addition to the gatekeeping of raider io, which is just a modern form of meet at AH for gearscore inspection, has caused people to avoid m+.
I know Iâm rambling on and on, but the old school, vanilla player in me also wouldnât mind if they just removed M+ entirely and just focused on the big three again- dungeons/raids/pvp and drop the âseasons.â After all, this is not an E-Sport. WOW was and still is at its core is a role playing game.
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