ex guildies from 3 tiers ago.
Hey, if they want to maintain the non-stop spammable dungeon model I can get behind that. But do my first solution⌠Put in dungeon sets, or use the WoD PvP gear model that upgrades the gear in M+ (or hell just downgrades the gear in the raid). Donât let the player base just grind M+ to acquire consistent mythic level gear, that also works in the mythic raid.
Otherwise⌠gearing at the start of the tier for anyone who cares about progression is: Grind M+. More so than it currently is.
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Mythic raid lockouts can go too. sure.
Ya no. Then the order of play is: Reset the first boss until every player has their gear. Then reset the second boss until every piece has been acquired. Rinse and repeat til the final boss.
Cause Iâm sure thatâll be a really fun model.
well. then keep ur lockout. but dont force us to have one in m+
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You donât have a lockout already. You can get as many heroic ilvl drops as you want. Thatâs more than fair.
Then make your M+ gear not effective in mythic raids. Or have it cap out at heroic with bonuses to prop it up to mythic gear inside M+.
already made a thread on this
here is it Easy fix for m+ gear
And Iâve already agreed with you (4th post in that thread) on it and stated at the start of this thread.
Either:
- Do dungeon sets/in-dungeon bonuses and maintain spammable gearing.
or
- Put a lock out on Mythic level M+ gear acquisition.
Just donât put in mythic level spammable gear thatâs equally effective in the raid.
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I lolâd. You literally are the 4th person in that thread agreeing with her. I also agree, Iâd love to see the return of set bonuses to raiding and pvp, and Iâd love to have a separate one for m+. Thatâd be great.
Thats like way back like Vanilla and maybe TBC. But after that a lot of people got to see the end game content.
I think that would be the best compromise over all. Have gear specific for pvp, raiding and M+. Or at least gear that works best in those aspects.
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that was me, i was wrong. apologies.
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I think it entirely depends on what the tier is. A tier like this with actual viable weapons and trinkets from the raid means that M+ gear is âwhateverâ under the assumption you actually get loot from the raid. On the other hand, tiers like Uldir where like all the weapons and trinkets are garbage meant that like every melee agi was using biletusks, harlans, and whatever other m+ trinket.
ok so check this idea out.
lets say heroic and M+10 drop 215. mythic raid is 230 ilvl.
+12 drops 1 piece of 220, 2 pieces if you 2 chest it
+13 drops 2 pieces of 220, 3 pieces if you 2 chest it
+14 drops 1 piece of 225, 2 pieces if you 2 chest it
+15 drops 2 pieces of 225, +20% for a 3rd piece if you 2 chest it
+16 drops 1 piece of 230 ilvl gear if you time it. no 2 chest bonus
+17 drops 1 piece of 230 ilvl gear, 20% chance for 2 pieces if in time, 40% if 2 chest
+18 drops 1 piece of 230 ilvl gear, 2 if you time it, chance for 3 pieces at a 2 chest
and so on. this drastically cuts down the amount of gear flowing from M+. it starts to ratchet down before mythic level.
no 3 or 4 pieces of mythic gear dropping for 2 chesting a +16
1.5 pieces of mythic gear for completing a +17 on time. with the loot tables, this gear can easily not be actually equipable for anyone in the party.
a group of 5 has 70? gear slots, so at a rate of about 1 piece of gear an hour, minus garbage no one can use, then pieces that are not really an upgrade over lower level items, than items that are no longer upgrades as the team gears, your looking at well over 100 hours of play time to gear if not 200. and that is with a consistent group of 5 passing all gear to the group. i think that is fair.
think of how many weeks of raids that equals if you were to be perfectly geared in 150 hours of play, is that not fair, and even that would be lucky as all get out. thats the equivalent of 18+ weeks of raiding 8 hours a week btw. honestly, that might even be to restrictive.
Dude. I can see you put a lot of work into that post, at the end of the day what it comes down to is that you donât see this like a progression raider.
Progression raiders grinded 1000âs of islands, 100âs of Maw of Souls dungeons. If you provide the path, then theyâre going to take it. Because thatâs just what they do. The problem is⌠they drag a lot of the people that donât want to do it along with them. Why? Because the entire scene is built on competition. Thatâs what makes the whole thing fun.
If I can be fully mythic geared by simply spamming keys, then thatâs what Iâm going to be doing. Cause if Iâm not, then Bill over there is a better candidate for my position as he has been spamming those dungeons. And hereâs the thing you have to realize⌠I would agree with sitting me for Bill.
You say 150 hours of play. All I see is another grind to remain competitive.
Hereâs another way to think about this. Do you know how they tune mythic? They use their own internal testers, then they tack on an extra arbitrary % (cause method is better then their testers). Then they release it to the public. Then they nerf the encounters based on how the WF race and the raiding playerbase at large progress through the content. M Fetid devourer was almost immediately nerfed after release. M KJ took numerous nerfs prior to his downfall.
Iâm in full on speculation mode, but Iâm willing to bet that if you release your system⌠those at the top will defeat the fights faster given that theyâre literally over geared for the encounters from your spammable source of gear (that they 100% can do and do do). Which means that who gets screwed during their progression? The more typical mythic raiders⌠Who arenât spamming those keys.
Sorry dude, but as much as you want it. Either put in affixes that make the gear that effective inside M+ alone, or put in a weekly lock out on mythic level acquisition. Your rewards arenât in a bubble. They effect all parts of the game (including PvP which is itâs own problem).
Why?
Why does mythic raiding have to be this propped up thing?
If it sucks so bad that people wonât do it other than âmuh gearâ then maybe that should tell people something.
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Requirements to do mythic raiding and commitment are so that if it doesnât drop something more interesting than other content than the time investment in it feel shallow. Thereâs no other content that requires as much team management or that is comparable to wiping 300+times on a boss.
And so every content needs itâs reward, the problem with m+ is the infinite scale. If they kept it as cm, nobody would have argue that cms should get gear as good as mythic raiding. But with m+, the scaling make it so it becomes a gear check for high keys because itâs the same mechanics just higher numbers.
My theory is a lot of people donât actually raid âcuz itâs so much funâ but rather they do it because of the social status that comes with it. This especially true for mythic raiders.
Yes I agree that for true hardcore raiders a lot of it is about the challenge but if that was absolutely true then gear and rewards wouldnât matter at all. Just give people standardized stats in that case. In fact standardized stats would make hardcore raiding more about skill than it is now.
But we all know they would never settle for that.
Ultimately WoW is probably more an about social status than any other thing when it comes to prime motivators. People want better grear not because of the bigger numbers but rather because it elevates their social status.