Key leavers, the final solution

Potentially several hours if you’re trapped in a run with unskilled players?

I want a relaxing 25-40 minutes, not 120 of suffering.


My group attempted a 22 Spires the other day. After we agreed it wasn’t going to be doable, we all left and retried it as a 21. That also didn’t work, so we all amicably went our separate ways but under your system we’d all already be 2/3 strikes.
The way things are now is probably for the better since I have yet to find a way to punish leavers without punishing innocent stuff as well.


Sure I did lol. Why did you join that group if you knew they couldn’t finish it?

24h seems to long imo, but a better thought out system than what most seem to come up with.

That was legit answered. Do you have a reading comprehension issue?

Punishment system for leavers: People will just troll/grief by AFKing or wiping the group on purpose to make others leave first.

Oh then we need to add a vote to end key feature: Too easily exploitable and people will press NO because they want to finish and others don’t or people will press NO just to troll.

How the discussion goes every time.


If i sign up for a key, I’m signing up for the time that is required to do the key. I’m not signing up for an hour long wipe fest. This is what people are talking about with “being held hostage”.


You don’t know that when you join.

Sometimes you get into group, especially on tyrannical weeks, where there just isn’t enough club in the bag to do a boss.

And if you put a punishment system in it’s just going to be that much harder to actually get pugs going.

No one will want to join a key hosted by someone with an IO not matching the key level. And no one hosting a key will want to invite anyone that isn’t extremely over qualified.

And “The Final Solution” might not be the branding you’re looking for.


Relaxing in a M+? You sound like you want to be carried

Do you ever stop making these threads?

Make a group with friends the EASIEST SOLITION

Also your title is quite gross


As I said, numbers can be adjusted accordingly. But it was a brainstorm idea I had.

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I never said that it could not be the same if one person voted to abandon when the rest voted to continue.

At least 2 votes either way will escape punishment, but if there is only a sole vote, sorry you lose, good day sir/ma’am.

All adding some kind of penalty will do is just cause people to stay and do the bare minimum to keep themselves from being reported. It will just drag the key out longer and basically ensure you are still not going to time it and maybe not even complete it.

Before any kind of penalty can be applied, you need to add a vote system to abandon the key entirely. If 3 group members vote to end the instance, it’s done. Plus once the timer is reached, everyone is free to leave without a penalty being applied.


Good M+ groups are relaxing even for high keys.

So you just need to queue as a duo and get to leave whenever you want?


add in a reset on the grace period after like 3-4 completed dungeons?

Yeah, low keys like +17s are super chill.


So you’re just completely effed if your connection just has a bad day? Like several dc’s in a row? Hardly seems fair.

Just… no. If you pug, you have to accept the reality that anyone could leave at any moment. The only way to “deal” with that is to play your best and for everyone to play their best to get the dungeon done in a reasonable time before things crop up.

I have rarely ever encountered leavers in dungeons that are going well. The worse a dungeon goes, and the more pug members you have, the greater the chance of a leaver. It’s simple probability.

How to mitigate this? Be the positive, helpful person in the group. Know your role 100% and do your best. Make the healer’s life easier by not taking unnecessary damage. Make other DPS life easier by using your interrupt kit. Make the tanks life easier by not pulling extra mobs.

There’s no way to have a punitive system like this that is not either a) wildly unfair or b) easily abused.

EDIT: Things I think might help instead of punishments:

  1. Reward SOME valor for bosses that have been defeated. Not enough that makes farming them worth it, but enough that if you down 2/4, you don’t feel like NOTHING was earned.

  2. Let a 5th party member join but that person is not eligible for loot or vault rewards. This would help out groups that just need 1 last push to beat a dungeon but someone bailed near the end. The leaver however is still eligible for depowered loot in the mail, but it will be lower ilvl.

Could be abused, yes, but it’d be a rather ramshackle way to do so. Most of the time I just want to finish the damn dungeon, don’t even care about the loot at that point. Like if 4 friends join and kick the pug 5th member… to get a 5th guildie in… that doesn’t really mean anything. The kicked person can still get loot and the joiner cannot at all.

well, at least after/including a vote, but remember a lot of the issues with M+ and leavers come from pugs, even partial premades are better then full blown pugs most of the time.

Oh I agree. I just think any system like this will be far to easily exploitable.

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Why is it that whenever I say this, everyone thinks that I’m saying to spend your entire evening in a dungeon.

Let’s use our brains.

Good groups are definitely relaxing. Just because a run went smooth doesn’t mean someone is being carried. Usually a non- relaxing run is when someone is being carried.