It’s funny that the Orcs were warlike, barbaric and morally loose to begin with, even before the Legion.
But it’s hysterical that they were this openly warlike, barbaric and morally loose in full view of the Draenei, who then thought “I’m sure that’s fine. That probably won’t be an issue later.”
Definitely. But this scenario with the orcs is more like if the Japanese called their homeland “Nihon,” and then somebody else came along and called it “Japan,” at which point the Japanese dropped the word “Nihon” and also started calling it “Japan.”
Granted, though, I can’t say there’s never been an instance where something like that didn’t happen (in the absence of anybody being conquered), since the world is big and weird and has existed for a long time. I’m also not sure (do you know?) whether Japanese speakers tend to refer to the country as “Japan” when speaking English, which is another thing I could see happening with the Orcs and Draenor (“It’s called Draenor to all you non-orcs, I guess”).
I think I could also be at peace with the idea that other planets hadn’t been part of orcish cultural context before, and that “our planet is called Draenor” just existed in a different conceptual space for them than “our living land is called [orc word].”
Dawgar is the only other name given to it and that is an ogre name. I actually like the name Draenor, It would have been nice and makes a little sense that we never got an orcish world for the orcish home planet. Even just a name for the walking land itself.
I’ve ran into three different kind of orc RPers when dealing with the name. There are orcs who say Draenor without problem. But there have also been orcs who have aggressively denounced my usage of Draenor and that the term is Dawgor/as well as orcs who use only Dawgor. Then there are orcs who say the home world, or our ancestral home.
And as I read on and type I will back up Baenura on her interaction with this orcish RPer.
Saying this didn’t happen I think throws a blanket over just how wild people are when it comes to their perception of story telling. A lot of the things I could string off, can easily be told to me that i’m making it up.
But her interaction is very real for people who make RPing a surface level hobby and not a creative writing one. Now…does that mean the orc should not have said it? Depends. If the player knows his character is wrong is one thing and is writing them at an angle at being very misinformed is one thing. But if the player is very much an Alliancer hater and only wants reason for war and argues about lore ect they probably believe this was a good reason.
I work very hard in how I like to approach orcish RP and what they represent. So a lot of the times, some orc rpers don’t see me beyond the flowers and good attitude. They see, probably the same way they take in every story. They see a 2D character who wants to hold hands with the alliance, passing out flowers and wanting hugs and thinks all is good and that peace is what we need…when that’s not all that makes a person.
I was working on a project that was largely orc based that someone spoke out and said I was an insult to the orc community. Everything about Gotosh is out of character, and that he’s the worst example he’s ever seen and the things that I push with him are very much NOT lore accurate. I felt very sad for him that this was his perception of me, but he was the sort of orc RPer who preferred hardcore war centric stories, and was…a bit of an jerk ooc. People came to my defense and he was removed, but it shows you that people sometimes don’t put as much thought as they should into their reasoning.
Could I figure out a way to justify this angry Draenor orc? Sure, we could say that, this iwas his simple way of…from the perspective of the orcs on rightful world, who were being told at the time the draenei were behind everything it can be included to say:
“And they call this land…Draenor…a name in their alien tongue. A name that claims this world as theirs. Don’t you see? It’s been there from the beginning, they never cared to learn our world. They came here to claim it and now they will claim all of us!”
Thats how I deal with interactions like that, I see the abusudity in the interactions, see how it can make sense and just swirl it around IC to see how indepth this person really is. Because it could be a genuine conspiracy this orc could have, or just someone with the bare minimum of effort to be violent. Both IC and OOC. I’ve learned to balance a lot of this by observing and paying attention. I find it fascinating.
So, I very much believe that happened. And even stranger things will happen. Not every wild story should be treated with ‘and they all clapped’. Life itself, is just weird sometimes (But its always good to be critical and skeptical, just always be careful on how and to who)
WE NAMED HIM JAPAN! Which means heart of Zipang which was the word westerners used to call Japan in those days which originated from the Chinese word used to refer to Japan. In Japan they used to refer to their country as Wa but at some point it was later changed to Nihon land of the rising sun.
I’ve always had my older orcs say “the old world,” or “the red world”. And my younger orcs born on Azeroth call it Draenor. I always figured it added a layer of generational perceptions of where “home” was.
World of Warcraft is an adaption of 1998’s Small Soldiers, and no one can change my mind.
In orcish culture, a planet is named after whoever crashes into it at the highest velocity.
Orcs are responsible for breaking the planet in the end. So it’s probably best they didn’t name it.
Meh, Draenei tooked it so we breaked it. I think that’s a fair trade.
This post has hovered on the edge of a few forum drama fights and it’s beautiful, nature is healing.
I feel really bad because this was supposed to be a crappy joke and then I almost caused a fight.
I’m just saying if you have an Alliance player beside a Horde player, and the Horde player says “world” in orcish, you get the orcish name for the planet.
Real talk here: Don’t feel bad. After two expansions of utter apathy, seeing some edging towards legitimate drama is honestly a good thing. My ribbing is all in good fun, but people getting feathers ruffled mean people are getting invested again. And in an 18 year old game, that’s fantastic.
Uh. Maybe rethink this haha
People getting mad is a damn sight better than people getting depressed and mopey about a video game. It means there’s passion rather than just sunk cost fallacy.
If you’re more referring to my use of the term edging and what that entails, it’s too late. You quoted it. It stays forever now. 
I took this as a genuine question actually! It reads like one at least. It seems like a legitimate thing to wonder about this sort of detail. Unfortunately, the nature of the forums is , even if the topic seems like it could be open for interesting discussion, can create misinterpretations or desire to argue. I’ve noticed, when it comes to the topic of lore, especially when its something like this, it opens up a lot of debate between Horde and Alliance and chances to make jokes about orcs in general. You get comments that lack nuance to the subject at hand, people genuinely interested and people who just want to be aggressive. Then, to add to it, the way you might type something won’t be read with the intended voice by someone else unless you really word and frame your question right, even then, all depends on the mood of the person.
People like to find any chance to tear open the wound of lore inconsistencies, bad writing or making other people feel bad by putting them on the spot because what ever that person said is either not bitter enough or not what they think is important. I feel like the topic of what Draenor is to the orcs is a great topic, and something I think could open up a more cultural and spiritual discussion on the world that maybe the world itself lacked a name because the elements are the world, they can feel and hear it and that’s all the needed.
I hope my post didn’t come off as aggravated, when I write long it’s because I’m very invested in the topic and I really like providing detail for how I think about things. In a way, it’s my hopes that should an RPer stumble upon it, it might help them think about their writing. So really, what I say is not just for the topic but a hopeful resource even if by chance or by one person.
Although, if you’re worried about causing fights, maybe pose a question along with it or write it in a way that it could be understood as a joke. I think from my PoV if you wanted to turn around, instead of tossing questions that might cause a rift, pose concepts to create discussion. Such as:
“How do the orcs refer to the world? We know that the Draenei are said to give it the name Draenor and is generally accepted as its name, and the name Dawgar is the ogre word. While Dawgar could be seen as the ‘orcish’ one, what do you think sets apart the orcs in their relationship to the world? By not knowing the an (currently unknowable) orcish term, what can we infer just by what we know on how they feel about it?”
Because here is what I find interesting. The Draenei were not, at the time, a shamanic people. They were spiritual, but not in the sense of a shaman. So they did not have the same relationship to the world as a shaman would. They appreciate it, enjoy it, see its value but they needed a name because their relationship is more surface than indepth. As well as making a deceleration of freedom to themselves to start a new life.
The ogre were more interested in magic and arcane, many of them had a lust for power, knowledge without care for consequences and subjugation of natural resources in pursuit of it. They gained shamanism as well, but their story in connection to the Throne of the Elements is evidence on how they take their surroundings. They have the name Dawgar but you could assume the only reason they gave it their own name because to them, this is their world. Where as the draenei just named with a feeling of hope.
The orcs, on the other hand, did not seek to subjugate or enslave the elements. Their pursuit of knowledge was the knowledge of survival. The world has always be integrated in their culture and they have always been inter mingled. They hold a high reverence to the elements and were able to push back ogre forces with the gift of the world itself. Maybe the reason we don’t know of a name, is because they feel the name. They know the world personally, they know the elements. It’s just home. And what better way way to know your home than by understanding it deeper than those who just see the surface.
But who knows, maybe someday we’ll learn the orcish word for that world. But I’m fine with the word Draenor for now.
WE NAMED HIM DRANOSH! IT MEANS HEART OF it’s cuz we’re all chronically online playing make believe in a game with the most inconsistent and poorly thought out writing and stakes are extremely low resulting in the most petty fights over the patchwork lore
It can all be solved if we instead uplift each other by finding the fun in other peoples ideas and see this as a collaborative experience, rather then seek reasons to tear people apart but to find what we can agree on while asking why. The act of role play is something that has been important to people since the dawn of time, acting, singing, improv, pretending to be confident in the mirror, acting out scenarios to get it right. It’s all creativity and art and I think it’s a gift we have the ability to pretend anything at all.
It’s a shame the things that have been done to the lore, and i have had my time ranting over certain things, but I still try to do it with a level of discussion. I think it says a lot about certain people when you see what they’re getting angry at and the why and its why these arguments can feel silly. I care about the state of how artists and writers are treated today and I care about the portrayal of more traditional cultures. My points toward patchwork lore always comes from that angle (sometimes).
Easier said then done, unfortunately a big issue is that people regardless of where we’re at in the story or much people beg for faction neutral, there is still a huge argument and divide between Horde and Alliance mentality , wants and needs and how either/or take in the story. Doesn’t mean I’ll stop though, I still want people to feel happy in their story and see role play as a creative work rather than just words. How cool is that we, as a people, can create?
I’ve always tried to give people space to people to play the races they enjoy. It’s not their fault they are the victim of Blizzard’s horrible writing.
Gnomes are an amazing, intelligent, very advanced race in this game that unfortunately Blizz has largely turned into the butt of a joke. So, I get it.
I rolled a Mag’har Orc and would probably enjoy RP’ing him very much.
Having been stunlocked by too many Gnome rogues to count back on my PVP days on my Tauren hunter, Gnomes are indeed butts.