Is vanilla's leveling experience overrated?

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
62

But it plateaus. The only thing that really makes you stronger is the fact that eventually you will be able to outlevel the content, and level doing lower level zones. At least until the late game zones.

I mean, sure, I get a more powerful spell after a few levels, but it’s a false benefit. It only feels more powerful because the spell was being held back. In modern WoW, the spell isn’t held back - it levels with you. The reason a new spell “feels better” in Vanilla is that you were constrained in the first place.

In BfA, “leveling” doesn’t not make you feel more powerful, but then, the 10 levels to 120 and the week it takes to get there, honestly, that’s not leveling. That’s not all there is. Dinging 120 opens the game up. NOW you get to start leveling. NOW you get to start accumulating “real” gear, plus the AP and Azerite powers.

120 is a bookkeeping problem, and is almost unrelated to actual character power. That’s iLevel and the Azerite powers.

Character level hasn’t been really important in that sense in some time.

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63

It’s not just “more powerful because spell was being held back” - It’s more subtle than that. It’s the 5 more weapon skill, 5 more defense skill, the couple of extra stat points really make a difference. Suddenly you’re hitting more and more often.

You’re 23, fighting 24-25 mobs and it’s a struggle. You ding and suddenly you’re on even footing and it feels so much better.

64

Depends on what area. Some people are probably going to be in for a rude awakening when they find out how slow it is.

But one thing people are probably going to love is how leveling feels rewarding through new abilities, new ranks of abilities, and constant talent points. You level today and you get a new talent row every 15 levels and very rarely get new ranks of abilities.

Plus there were a few leveling checkpoints with class quests, mounts, and gaining access to a gear slot since some gear didnt start dropping for a while. Such as shoulders werent a thing until maybe 15 but they were gray anyways but eventually you’d get one with stats or helms and necks weren’t until high 20s or early 30s. Some of these “checkpoints” still exist but because leveling speed is so quick they don’t feel overly rewarding.

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65

Leveling in Vanilla WoW was a shared experience. Even if you primarily leveled solo, you had the long road trip to 60 in common with every other 60 you saw. It was a right of passage, an endeavor taken on leading eventually to full game adulthood.

This was destroyed in the modern game by offering ways to bypass the leveling process and otherwise expediting it,

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66

Story time.

You are a Rogue, making your name in the Barrens. You have killed any number of wild beasts, and you have been invited to a cavern, a Wailing Cavern if you will.

As you adventure, you bond quickly with another Rogue, and a Priest. They appreciate your measured performance, and they invite you to their Guild. As you fight through the dungeon a quick familiarity grows between you, and you plan to assist eachother in a task given only to Rogues after you make your way out of the Dungeon.

You quickly make your way north, and assassinate a traitor, taking his head, and a mixture deemed important. You go to deliver your package, and in a twist of fate, you are poisoned!

The cure lies in a place called Tarren Mill you are told. So you and your new friend decide to make the trek but what do you find? Tarren Mill is under siege by the foul Alliance! Your Horde brothers and sisters lie dead, and you must try and get into town, to save yourself from the 7 day Poison.

Moving to the north, you Sprint while their attention has been taken to the South, and you are able to complete your quest. You laugh with your new friend as fate has smiled on you, and you can Hearth out, returning to Orgrimmar with your new knowledge of Poisons.

Crafting a new Poison has never felt so good, like such progression of your character.

This is why we yearn for Vanilla. This is why Classic WoW is superior, and this is why PvP Realms is where its at.

I’m here for the WORLD of Warcraft.

67

If I was designing an MMO I would take a hybird approach to how retail and classic do it.

-I would keep the speed of ratail 3. So leveling speed in retail is a 10, leveling speed in vanilla is a 5, lvling speed in EQ1 is a 1 (lol). I would put speed at a 7
-I would keep the danger of over pulling that vanilla had. Kept lvling exciting
-I would keep the chapter system retail uses for quests in zones

  • I would have 2-3 hidden quest chains in each zone to encourage exploring
68

I feel like part of the satisfaction is also the talent trees. You get many more points to put somewhere throughout the whole experience. The talents themselves are much more incremental but you have much more choice and greater customization. It makes every level you work towards rewarding as each level gives you a tangible increase in power. In retail you get 1 point every 15 levels and only get to pick from three things (often with an obvious choice). There were no “oh i’ll only put 2 points into this and 3 points into that instead of the full 5”.

It also gives you a much better sense of building your character. This, along with better difficulty, makes the leveling process feel much more rewarding in vanilla than in retail. Just my two cents.

69

Nah, it’s fine.

70

Seems you got over your problem because you’re level 120 now lol.

71

I really liked the feeling where my stress test priestess was rather squishy.

You don’t get power word: shield until level 6. At level 5, I decided to take up herbalism and alchemy for the immediate benefits. The starting armor elixir is serious business for a clothie in greys and whites. I was at 150% armor by using an elixir. Hot stuff. I did some trading with people I was grouping with and got an armor kit (handing out health potions and strength elixirs). Someone gave me a bit of silver, and I bought a wand off of AH.

Get level 6 and the shield, an elixir up, a wand. I felt like a boss. The unstoppable winning wars of attrition boss, but still: it was awesome.

Even buffs at much more worthwhile. Fortitude makes a bigger difference if you are sometimes getting down to 10% health. Mark of the wild (awww, I’ve missed you). Armor (we’ve discussed my priest being squishy) and then at the rank 2 getting plus all stats (heck, prior to the wand, the priest appreciated the strength for hitting things with her staff - and the staff was a grey trash drop that was a dps upgrade over the white mace… queue the running into Darnasus to hit stuff with a staff instead of a mace).

The RPG aspects intertwine with the slower leveling to create a world experience that is worthwhile long before hitting the level cap.

72

Yeah, I resubbed in hopes of a beta invite, which of course I didn’t get, and to reach out to some old friends to let them know about the Classic guild I’m forming. Figured I’d level my toon up while I was on. I did so, got bored really quickly, and now I’m allegedly playing on a vanilla private server and having a blast. Vanilla is better than BFA in pretty much every aspect.

Anyway, killing time until Classic comes out, like everyone else on here…

73

Yes and so many more reasons as well, in addition to the challenge and seeing your character progress (levels, gear, talents, etc) I miss a lot of the RPG elements of Vanilla, things like hunter pet progression, ranged ammo, access quests (MC Attunement, etc), rogue poisons, lock soulshards, etc, etc.

Because of the more challenging content, social interactions were more common during your journey to 60.

These things made the game more immersive.

74

Is it overrated?

Yes. Definitely.

That doesn’t mean it isn’t fun, though.

75

yes, beyond overrated.

76

Leveling is more engaging… more dangerous with regards to dying.

Leveling takes a lot more time. And because it does… upgrades matter, each level’s talent point matters, professions matter, your choices matter… as they can all affect that time, making it shorter or longer.

Because more things matter… it is more engaging. You find yourself planning more. Researching items more, quest rewards more.

Because you don;t get your first mount until 40, movement matters… which makes gold matter and important to have when you get there.

First aid matters for most classes, potions matter, the random buffs you get from fellow players matter. Items with only a couple stamina, or intellect, or strength, etc… matter.

Now consider all of these things that matter in Classic and ask yourself… does any of it matter in modern WoW? Where the stat squish means you can level a few levels and the quest rewards are the exact same as what you got 3 levels ago?

Where pots, bandages, buffs, professions, etc do not make any significant contribution to your character leveling time/ease.

Certainly not the 1 new talent tree item every 15 levels?

Gold is also meaningless… and getting mounts MUCH earlier also just make your leveling that much quicker.

Is Vanilla’s leveling experience overrated? Just the opposite. You just don’t realize how much fun it is to be engaged with the progress of you toon, until you get a green drop and compare it to the white you are wearing.

You don’t know how fun it is to look at a 3 pack and think… now how am I going to get this done without dying?

The experience is amazing… and is almost 100% missing from modern WoW.

77

I personally think a harder leveling experience is better, but only if there’s good rewards on leveling up.

In vanilla WoW you have spell ranks able to be cast at different intervals. So almost every level, even though you’re just getting what you would passively in retail, there’s a visible gain of a spell in Vanilla.

I think that’s way more fun than learning 5 skills before level 30, then spending 90 levels getting nothing.