In PvE this is not even close to being objectively true, and if it is for you you’re doing something wrong and likely not using all of your CDs
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Yes, ranged healing isn’t a thing on paladins anymore
So in terms of Glimmer build play style (I usually go with BoV because…PuGs), does it generally involve Holy Shock on people that might not need healing now just so they can benefit when they need it later? As in- group damage event coming up; make sure you have glimmer on everybody?
This really depends on your group. Like for example in a pug you aren’t confident in, spreading glimmer might be your priority, but in guild groups for example I use Holy Shock more for DPS than I do healing. Play it by ear basically.
Also if you’re using BoV make sure you’re taking Saved by the Light as well. They synergize really well.
I just switched to Venthyr from Kyrian for two reasons.
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For keys 17 and above, most started asking if I was venthyr before I could get an invite. Some groups want the additional damage output Ashen Hallow provides. Ellesmere has finished raiding for the tier but still continues to push keys as Venth. He just started a Kyrian alt so he could play DT which he says he enjoys more. But still interesting that he is pushing keys as venth on his main.
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Because it gave me a new challenge. Working on my 18s, and hoping to reach 20s. But I don’t see myself progressing beyond that level without finding a regular key group for better coordination.
In the end, I may switch back to Kyrian. But, for now enjoying something new and have still been able to time keys as either. For venth, it’s just learning when to use the CDs. With Kyrian, you can pretty much just bash whichever one you want most of the time because DT is so powerful for topping off groups in a pinch.
Here is my main for anyone who is interseted 
-chilicheese
He’s doing this because no one else in his team is venthyr
I’m considering swapping to venth myself to try something new also, I’ve seen it on hpal a lot from streamers but don’t see many venth prot and I think it would be fun. I did a weekly 15 a while back with a 9/10 m raider prot paladin who did 19k dps on hakkar (top damage in the group) But I think the renown grind is holding me back from doing that.
He stayed Venth because the Dungeon Bonus from HoA and SD are very powerful when played around. Ashen only has Priority Damage over DT, in the overall they are closer then most people think they are which leads to skewed opinions. Outside of a group I’d heavily argue that DT is a much better CD to use.
You lose a lot of survivability going Venth as Prot, the First Avenger talent gives a very large Absorb shield when you use DT due to the number of shields going out. It’s also a 5 target silence meaning that grouping up casters is a lot easier. You also lose out on the Mastery Buff (% DR in Consecrate) which is pretty nice and the 3% magic DR is a nice finish where as Venth souldbinds aren’t as good defensibly where prot struggles.
Weird take. You can be stressed and entertained.
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Was one of my concerns. But it took less than week to grind the renown to fill out the Mad Duke’s tree.
The bigger grind is enough soul ash to make the Mad Paragon legendary. It will take me another two weeks.
I agree. So far good play and cd management has felt like solid heals with the addition of that priority damage burst.
There are definitely moments though when being able to smash DT would be nice. However, I find holy avenger is pretty powerful in an emergency, although not a perfect substitute.
Yeah I know the losses I will take if I switch. I’m still interested in trying it out. I would be playing defensive with my talents and legendary and getting most of my damage from AH. Just something I’m interested in experimenting with.
I don’t do high enough keys where min/maxing will affect me too much I think. Only got 1 19 left before I start trying 20s
Oh ok not too bad it seems.
Why mad paragon legendary though? What content would you be using that for?
Only because it was the recommendation on the mythic+ section of wingsisup.com.
Just allows more DPS during AH windows.
No. Holy is by far the most boring healing spec.
Resto druids and shamans are the most fun I’ve had on healing specs in a long time.
Interesting, I thought he played shock barrier still with venth
I think it’s incredibly fun, it’s has a nice rhythm to it and you play it correctly you’re mostly doing instant casts so while you do have to stick to a mob in order to be efficient, you’re rewarded for doing so by having the mobility of a melee.
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im lvling my pally as holy atm. i have to say the melee hpally isn’t my thing. it does alright when the dmg isn’t high. the moment the group all start taking heavy dmg the crusader strike gimmick falls apart and you have to go back to casting healing in every gcd.
makes you wonder why u put all ur eggs into the crusader strike related talent basket lulz.
also all i’ve done is 5 man dungeons cuz im not lvl cap yet XD
You will absolutely cast alot more direct healing while leveling since your toolkit isn’t fully fleshed out, and there’s no shame in that. Alot of what makes hpally feel whole and complete are traits and cooldowns you get later on, like having wings and Glimmer.
For example, Crusader’s Might. It is incredibly good for your output, HOWEVER, it’s very dependent on the trait you get @level 33 that gives your Crusader Strike a 2nd charge, then you can bank the stacks and essentially fully reset HS’s cooldown by dumping them. You’re better off just running Bestow Faith until that point.
There’s also the factor of there being a 40 level range of players in leveling dungeons and all the wonky scaling issues that can create. The point is that unfortunately between wonky scaling and not having a fully fleshed out toolkit, leveling an hpally can be a poor assessment of how it actually plays.
I really enjoy Holy pally even though I use a different playstyle because i cannot stand the glimmer/shock barrier build.
The alternative build i use seems fairly stable in the content i run though so I’ll have to get back with you on how it holds up in higher keys and heroic raids.
I prefer bestow faith/ beacon of faith and Inflorescence of the sun well for a more traditional healer playstyle.