Also, I find that suggestion that Survival and MM played similar to be laughable. Do arms and fury play similar because they both use execute and whirlwind? Even pretending that’s true, MM got remade into a stand-and-shoot subclass that forgoes their pets. So could survival have not just remained as a mobile ranger? That’s literally what the hunter class is described as by blizzard themselves, mobile rangers with pets and traps. Ions reasoning makes no sense. As much as Blizzard has improved on certain aspects of listening to feedback during this alpha cycle, they are still very clearly reluctant to listen to feedback or reassess things that players have not enjoyed about combat changes (GCD as another example).
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But if class fantasy isn’t your thing, why care if the damage is instant instead of over 2 seconds. It literally does not matter. . . Kill command, explosive shot, and chimera all did the same thing with different names.
Chimera and Kill Command we’re direct damage, Explosive Shot was a DOT.
Seems like you have trouble with your memory. Perhaps you should see someone about that. Or get one of those apps that helps you try and improve your brain’s function.
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No offence, but what’s the difference when it was used on cd anyway?
Not only that but Chimera Shot was a cleave and Explosive Shot has the Lock and Load interaction. Saying two specs are equivalent because they both have an instant cast that does damage on a cooldown is nonsense. Wildfire bomb is also instant damage on a cooldown. Does that mean it’s just Kill Command and Survival is stealing from BM? Oh, wait, Survival right now actually has Kill Command…
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It could be purged before it’s full effect. Which is a huge difference.
But let’s stick with the obvious short sighted argument you presented. What’s the difference between Mortal Strike and Rampage, they are both used on CD right?
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Pve? None. Pvp? Healing debuff.
With your logic, what’s the difference between any two damage spells then? Every spec in the game has a top priority skill? I don’t understand your point. Chimera, explosive shot, and kill command all had different effects. They all interacted with talents differently. How else do damage spells differ from each other?
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Melee survival is a failed spec, I am tired of getting denied to every pug raid or m+ because I want to play a spec that nobody wants on their team. Melee survival is the only viable hunter spec for pvp and even in pvp its mediocre vs all the other classes. Survival is terrible in pve with every other melee class doing what you do but better.
I love the class fantasy of fighting in melee range alongside a pet, ive tried DK it feels terrible to me, honestly melee survival is fun but I would have way more fun with bm being melee and survival being ranged again. Bm melee would add more flavor to the game mainly because its a braindead spec at the moment, it would add more flash compared to now where you stare at an npc slapping another npc while you shoot the occasional bow shot. If you were fighting alongside your pet as a bm hunter with your already instant cast spells it would feel better, it would feel like you’re in the heat of battle with a loyal pet.
When I think of Survival I don’t think of melee, I think of a hunter with a ranged weapon that uses traps, poison, and stealth. I picture a spec that will do anything to survive with underhanded tactics, not a melee spear slapping boy that is useless in every pve scenario. Blizzard is detatched from the hunter community, they don’t know what to do with the class, it shows. I am excited for shadowlands but if I am forced into BM hunter for another expansion I will quit the game, an expansion can be good but if a class plays terrible that will ruin it.
Video isnt me but he explains my problems with this spec in a decent way.
Do yourself a favor before making a further fool of yourself. Go read every class forum, now try and apply your logic. Every class is apparently terrible to play besides maybe DH. If Blizz listened to the people on the forums, everyone would be walking raid bosses.
In short, you’re wrong.
p.s. saying I don’t want a melee hunter option because I don;t like melee on hunters isn’t feedback, especially 4 years later.
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Maybe you need to get better gear first? 256ilvl is not enough for even hc dungeons not to talk about m+++…
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This obviously isn’t my main, you should know that posting on a level 10, my point still stands these are valid complaints from many survival hunter players. My main is only 463 ilvl which is not impressive it self, its just annoying to being forced into playing bm hunter to gear for survival.
I am probably a below average player but I only heroic raid and its really irritating being forced into a spec that just watches a pet slap a target while you do nothing. It would feel more engaging to slap a target while fighting next to a pet, at least thats my opinion on bm. I just wish Blizzard cared about the hunter community because its obvious they don’t, every thread on here gets ignored even the most replied ones that raise valid points to the community.
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Last I checked, other classes have been receiving iterative updates in the alpha that have been based on player feedback…so…whats your point?
Saying you don’t like a spec because you feel like it was a failed experiment, that it doesn’t play well, it doesn’t fit into the class fantasy, that it doesn’t represent a specialization of a hunter, that it’s just melee-bm, that none of our baseline abilities given back to us in shadowlands to emphasize our class even make sense or work with survival because it is such a poor fit as a spec, is all valid feedback. Saying, hey, we don’t like this dumb spec, is also valid feedback.
You want more specifics, there is a 100+ post feedback thread in the alpha forums with constructive and specific feedback. So again, whats your point?
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This isn’t my main hunter either, but when I played this one as only survival I never got declined for my spec. As a matter of fact, not once as anyone asked what spec I was on either of my hunters.
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Played the whole xpac as SV. Know how to do it? Find a guild. Level up your own keys. For last few months I just pugged my weekly 15 and had no problems
You don’t get refused because of your spec. You get refused because there is someone higher ilvl(raider io) queueing up
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Ilvl 463 and your being forced into BM?
Girl who do you play with thats forcing you into BM?
That sounds like a cutting edge problem but at ivl 463? Having to play BM for a shot at gear? My word!!!
I main Surv and even when pugging keys and in my Heroic raids, not once have i ever been asked to play BM. Not once.
Maybe its not the spec, maybe its them is all im trying to get at tho
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I myself during the whole og BFA (let’s skip the timeframe of dazar alor due to military stuff), I seen the message “sorry we needed range” less than 5 times
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Maybe im just retarded or on a server with toxic people either way I have been kicked for not being ranged about 25/100 times. It adds up and makes you bitter, at first you understand afterwards it just gets to you. Survival is fun but in its current state its removing 1 ranged from the limited pool of ranged specs and adding to the big pool of melee specs in the game. I have been told countless times that any melee class does it better than survival so why bother, regardless the spec is fun but its annoying being shut down constantly.
I’ve seen “Sorry we needed melee” 0 times 
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This is such a stupid argument/defense. He didn’t say “Well other players can’t tell them apart.”
He said they were basically the same because they use ranged shots in their rotation.
That is literally like saying every spell caster is the same because they cast spells.
Or
Every healer is the same because they heal.
Or
Every melee is the same because they use melee attacks.
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Yeah… I have no clue what Ion is on about there.
I guess he means that the fantasy started to overlap since MM is supposed to be all about ranged shots and what not, while SV is supposed to be focused around traps and utility… and I guess he doesn’t like that SV’s damage all came from ranged shots just like MM? God knows.
I would still argue that even if SV and MM were similar that they shouldn’t have removed the entire gameplay of the spec. Maybe the fantasy overlaps, but the gameplay sure as hell didn’t and they could’ve easily reinvented SV’s fantasy just like Combat/Outlaw to better differentiate SV from MM in Ion’s tastes.
Oh well, I think this kind of killed the possibility of RSV returning for me.
My fingers are at least still crossed that they reintroduce Lock and Load into MSV since there’s a DoT and an explosive ready for that mechanic to return…
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