Tyrande greatest skill is holding a grudge even when it’s no longer in her interest to do so; at this point she has to know a sizable chunk of the horde wants sylvanas dead just as much as she does but either that doesn’t matter to her or this whole night warrior business is interfering with her ability to rationalize.
The Horde already has a Warchief. All the Horde needs is for someone to actually defeat Sylvanas in combat.
My friend, if you bring the head of the banshee, she will forgive, trust me. She hates Sylvanas but since Sylvanas used the Horde to do her bidding, it still haunts her that team red was burning trees. That will go away with time once she has the banshee’s head in her hand.
I already voted when I became a Sylvanas Loyalist… 
You’re welcome to ask Thalyssera how easily Tyrande forgives.
She will not want bloodshed against people who were mind controlled into doing a lunatic’s bidding. It appears this way because Sylvanas is not yet dead, once that abomination dies, trust me, Tyrande will change. Which is why I stress it, day after day, that the banshee has to be killed.
This.
This should have happened for his complicity in the use of Blight at UC anyways…but Anduin is a clown anyways.
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Sylvy used blight because clearly she didn’t value even the Horde soldiers. She wanted to use Horde as tools and anyone talking crap against Baine is probably a Sylvy loyalist who are also part of the problem. True Horde would want to rebuild, to prosper, to attain peace. It’s very obvious that the orcish warlike mentality needs to be put to rest. After all, what will Horde attain from fighting wars with Alliance? Nothing important but just mass casualties. I personally don’t want to massacre and kill Horde, I want peace and prosperity between both factions. Why are there people in the Horde who want me to dead, makes no sense. What will killing and non-stop war achieve? This is orcish mentality and needs to be abolished.
The Horde needs to sit down and realize that the Alliance is not going anywhere. So it’s better to sit down and talk as friends than become enemies. They aren’t gonna win a war against us, it will never happen, they will only send more of their people to their deaths and it will be futile. Baine is right because he wants to rebuild the Horde and not through wars and genocide but through peaceful negotiations and co-existing.
Sure we can vote. Only after I somehow drag Kael’thas out of the shadowlands. He would get my vote instantly. Never should have been a villain to begin with
The “traditional warlike mentality” is actually a relatively new concept for the orcs; for much of their history conflict between clans was actually determined more by duels then open warfare; you can thank Gul’dan’s manipulation for this shift.
Baine was there and didn’t even so much as protest it’s use. He is a war criminal, that Sylvanas left and then everyone sat around and wants to sing kumbaya by the campfire and let Anduin make a speech in Org. then leave without punishing ANYONE else for the atrocities and warcrimes at Teldrassil and UC is an abomination of leadership on Anduins part. His personal guard should put him down just like Varians should have at the end of SoO for HIS gross incompetence that led us to where we are now.
Justice for the dead, Justice for Teldrassil and Justice for our soldiers at UC…DEATH TO THE HORDE and NO PEACE UNTIL THERE IS JUSTICE!
Yes you are correct, sorry if I made a generalization however Garrosh was not tainted by any fel magic or manipulated by Guldan, his vision of the Orcish Horde was very similar to Orgrim. They both had same views and wanted to conquer the entire planet and enslave other races.
I think that we don’t need to stoop down to their level and do that, otherwise we will not be any better than they are. Yes I do not like what Horde did at Teldrassil however I don’t think massacring them will bring back our loved ones. Instead, as difficult as it may sound, I think it’s better that we kill the culprit for this mess and that is Sylvanas. Eventually working with the Horde ofcourse for as long as they agree to change and get rid of their warring mentality.
If what Tyrande says is true and the Horde doesn’t change and they continue to go to war with the Alliance, then that option should be spoken about, but for now I say kill the banshee witch first then think about what to do next after she is dead. It’s very possible that after the banshee hag dies with her head in Tyrande’s hand, that Tyrande will probably be satisfied.
The path to peace aint easy but requires a lot of talk and negotiations which as difficult it may sound it is possible with Sylvy now gone from the faction picture, it’s all up to the Horde though, are they willing to change for the better? As I said before and I will say now, the Alliance aint going anywhere, they will have to recognize the sovereignty of the Alliance just as how the Alliance will have to recognize them, that has to happen first.
After all the stuff they did (no thanks to Sylvy) the Alliance in general are willing to talk to them and create peaceful dialogues. But this is the time for them to sit down and talk. If another Teldarassil happens in the future, I am afraid the Alliance will have to retaliate and do something far more terrible to them which I fear can happen one day if Anduin dies. War is not a joke. I hope they realize it’s not a child’s play and with Teldarassil they gone too far, even if it was orchestrated by Sylvanas. Even then, the Alliance wants to talk to them, even after all that, so that shows the Alliance does have patience but that patience will run out one day.
Justice for genocide is NOT a slap in the wrist and some jail time. It means you put them DOWN.
Not about bringing back loved ones…but you don’t give war criminals a pass. When a bully hits you in the face you don’t back down, you stand up and smash him in the face with a club, that’s how you teach them not to mess with you. If you just back down they keep doing it and then do it to others.
This way of thinking is ridiculous, she didn’t perpetrate her crimes alone, she had MANY helpers.
Seems to me we gave that a try with Vol’jin and Varian (and his stupidity) and it got us a LOT MORE DEATH AND DESTRUCTION. At some point you have to learn.
No, you don’t reason with mass murdering hobo’s. You squash them and then you IMPOSE THE PEACE YOU WANT AND DESERVE.
Well, Anduin wants to give them another shot, he seems to believe peace can happen. Like I said, i’m not agreeing with warcriminals, I definitely feel the people (Horde commanders and such) involved in Teldarassil should be brought to justice, but the entirety of the Horde is kinda a stretch, I have conflicting thoughts over that. Remember Saurfang was also there in Teldarassil but he became Sylvanas arch-enemy afterwards.
Also I think the Horde in general have always been afraid of Sylvanas, they just didn’t have the spine to confront her. Aside from Baine, everyone was kinda too scared. They fear her, lol. But yeah, I think anyone who was actively involved in Teldarassil should be brought to justice, just not the entirety of the Horde because that would mean many people who weren’t even there. Like civilians and such.
And you’re ignoring literally the most fundamental aspect of why this even happened in the first place. Of course in every war we’re going to lose manpower. However, this cost was offset exactly by defeating the Horde in every single engagement we fought in.
The Horde is absolutely in a no better position after both losing territory and losing engagements. There is no doubt that both sides suffered heavily but it is a fact that the Horde had suffered more and actually was defeated by us.
It was unstable until the Alliance defeated your faction. The Horde is in a mode of recovery after losing the Fourth War. Sure it wasn’t totally destroyed but saying that a government that’s existing in a state of recovery and comparing that to a government whose always been stable is a fairly moronic comparison. It’s pretty obvious that the Alliance very much is more politically stable than the Horde.
Except that we actually aren’t seeing that at all. So far what we’ve been presented with is the Horde collapsing upon itself due to disagreements in its own government. Saurfang, Baine, and Sylvanas all exemplify how terribly structured the Horde was. Saurfang openly betrayed his faction, Baine did the same, and Sylvanas outright left. Leaving your faction with essentially nothing but a lost war and needed time to recover from a defeating blow.
From the perspective of the Alliance, really our most pressing issue is whether or not to continue fighting the Horde into extermination, which is not necessary, considering how badly the Horde was defeated and the current state it is in. I agree with Tyrande and Genn, but them not making a single agreement does not equate to total civil war like the Horde went through again.
Yea because he is a soiboy cuck who believes in peace at any cost and look where that got us. He couldn’t even come to the aid of Tyrande when she needed him most…but he was quick to hand his new BFF Suarfang “every last soldier” AND his fathers sword to use. Yea, no respect for him or his way of thinking, he is weak and never learns.
The ONLY reason i can’t call for him to be brought to justice is he is already dead. He doesn’t get a pass for what happened at Org. and NONE of those that were enemies at Org. should get a pass at all, they were all prepared to fight.
Like i said, you don’t ask the Horde for peace, you CRUSH THEM and then IMPOSE THE PEACE YOU WANT. Nothing short of this will suffice, they are naturally aggressive murder hobo’s bent on only their own wants and needs and always searching for more power.
I agree but now that the big bad banshee is gone, maybe there is hope for change?
Citation required that the alliance won every single engagement while still somehow still suffering catastrophic losses.
Concievably the horde could have contested both darkshore and the arathi highlands but at that point they were more interested in ending the pointless war that sylvanas had dragged them into.
Further, it was sylvanas that was defeated by a joint horde alliance force; had Anduin pushed it by himself he would have failed so we know that the losses suffered by the alliance over the course of the conflict were at least as bad if not worse.
Again: Alliance with support of the horde.
Also as we can clearly see from the aftermath of the 4th war the alliance is cracking.
Hence why you should be taking notes on the new horde council for how to reform your own faction.
Well for as long as Anduin is High King, what the other racial leaders think is irrelevant because the final word comes from Anduin and nobody else. I guess the notes you can take is how not to burn down and kill thousands of innocent people just like Sylvanas did. Takes notes on how to intervene and stop a merciless mass murderer if something similar occurs in the future and not stand around like dummy and watching your bloodthirsty warchief tell you what to do. For Tyrande to be upset it is absolutely normal and I don’t blame her. I just don’t believe in killing innocent people over the actions of one person. While some Alliance folks want full eye for an eye revenge, I don’t. I want the banshee dead first and foremost.
Ironically I do believe in eye for an eye but there is no way I can agree with mass murdering people, even if it’s the Horde populace we’re referring to. Killing innocent people is just wrong and I hope that the Horde has learned something from what their warchief ordered them to do at Teldarassil.