I missed that because I was on break from this game, but I get what you’re saying.
Wish I was there. That sounds like fun!
This 100%!
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We don’t drive the narrative in WoW, so having an evil storyline would be pointless.
You’re not making those decisions, you never have. You’re just the random idiot doing the legwork for 50g and a pat on the head.
If you want a game where you can genuinely be evil and have that be satisfying, play Wrath of the Righteous and go the Lich path, or if you’re feeling really spicy, the Swarm-That-Walks path.
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Have you tried being a Maw Walker?
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I too want to join Fyrakk’s crusade.
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Then you’ll need to find a single player game like that. mmorpg’s usually stay pretty linear, and for good reasons.
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Same! I really wish there was a Black Empire 3rd faction, with their own campaign.
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If you are wanting to be the ‘bad guy’ in an MMO your best bet is probably Star Wars The Old Republic. The story system in that is more like scenarios where your choices can make an actual difference without disrupting others or the rest of the game.
If you are just wanting to no longer be ‘the chosen one’ or the other various titles, well, that is the story in Dragonflight. We are just the mercenaries running around doing things for the factions this time. Sure, we are interacting with a lot of big names but it is not as if we are being treated like the main character this time around.
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Stay in the DK starting zone.
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That’s one of the things I love in LoTRO. When you get to a certain level, you can make an evil character. It’s PvP, of course once you do the initial quests to get used to things, but can be quite fun.
If I had friends to be a pack of worgs with, or orcs and worgs, it would have been a hoot. I remember slaughtering some NPCs and a couple of PC elves discovered them and started trying to hunt me down. They did, eventually, but good times.
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No, there’s an entirely storyline specifically for edgy preteens. People with actual character beyond “lul evil” need not apply.
Pretty much. It would end up the same way it does in SWTOR, where if you make evil decisions the NPCs stand around telling you how awful you are for a few minutes and then nothing really changes.
Because ultimately, we all have to be playing pretty much the same game - it’s an MMO after all, we need to have the same outdoor zones and quest mobs and stuff or it doesn’t work. So nothing really earth-shaking can ever be left to a specific player’s choice.
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That’s unfortunately the problem with MMOs. No freedom regarding the course of the story.
When I think about Baldur’s Gate 3, for example… woah… now that’s freedom! Whether you want to be good, evil, or something in between.
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And this is why we need actual role-playing in WoW. Maybe have clearly evil organisations out there that we could choose to build reputation with. Evil and organisations of “ill repute”. Maybe people should get a bit more out of joining the Bloodsail Buccaneers then a title and a cool hat. Imagine Bloodsail worldquests that opens up once you reached friendly with them.
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Play horde, then. You can level as an Orc whipping the lazy peons into shape. That solves your problem.
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What if you could chose to bad, and what if chosing to bad put you in an opposite faction state no matter which faction you were and people could try to stop you in pvp.
Boom I just saved the game!
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I agree about the champion hero nonsense. None of my characters have done anything noteworthy in game since before BC ie kill a raid boss when he was relevant so calling me that is just plain stupid. My characters are just run of the mill soldiers.
Also this is the same player base who thinks faction conflict is past its relevance but hand holding and working together isn’t.
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While I can’t say I’ve had an urge to “be bad” in WoW I have done some community theater and will admit that playing the role of a chaotic or evil character in a play is a lot more interesting than representing someone who always shines up their goody two shoes.
I guess Dungeons & Dragons offered a variety of “alignments” a player could choose when engaging in fantasy play for a reason.
Perhaps artificial intelligence entering the game sphere will enable companies like Blizzard to present us with far less linear and more flexible storylines - helping customers who choose to roleplay their characters a path that feels more authentic and true to who they choose to be.
Rather than just looking to “bad” as an alternative to lawful and good - how about ultimately offering players a choice between nine of the Dungeons and Dragons alignments:
Lawful Good
Neutral Good
Chaotic Good
Lawful Neutral
Neutral
Chaotic Neutral
Lawful Evil
Neutral Evil
Chaotic Evil
Note that this would NOT necessarily be a new concept. When I think back on the games I played growing up, the Ultima series stands out as one of the most unique and compelling. 1985’s Ultima IV , which I played on the Nintendo as well, was the game that I fell in love with because it went so much against the grain of a traditional RPG. There weren’t villains you had to vanquish or an evil that had to be defeated. Your main goal was to be a good person and go throughout Britannia helping people. 1988’s Ultima V flipped morality on its head by pushing the virtues of the avatar into a moral absolutism that was terrifying. Further games in the series would push the boundaries of ethics, forcing players to question the binary values they’d normally associate with simpler gaming narratives.
The Ultima game’s goal of pursuing the eight virtues and becoming the avatar was so much more fascinating than the trope of fighting back some evil dudes while some god-like authoritarian gives you a never-ending list of chores (all of which might kill you - but they could complete themselves with the snap of a finger)
Ultima IV begins with a small experiment in personal ethics. Your character enters a Renaissance fair where a fortune teller invites you into her covered wagon. There, using cards reminiscent of those from the tarot, she presents a series of questions. For example: You are told by your king to evict a poor serf from the land. Do you honorably uphold your duty to your liege, or do you show compassion by refusing the order, thereby suffering dishonor? When the fortune teller finishes the reading, a strange portal in a stone circle opens and you step through to Britannia.
The gameplay in Ultima IV was similar to that of many of its competitors: visit cities and towns; talk with residents to find clues on various quests; buy and sell food, weapons, and armor; explore dungeons; solve puzzles; wield magic; and, of course, fight monsters.
But, in Ultima IV, chasing and slaughtering a creature that is fleeing from battle would be considered cowardly. Giving your hard-won gold pieces to a starving beggar will help you along the path of compassion.
Some games have been influenced by Origin Games Ultima… for example, I see some of it in Skyrim (of course), But also, in the decaying steampunk city of the game BioShock, your power level is dependent on whether you save the lives of or “harvest” a group of genetically enhanced orphaned girls. The popular Witcher 3: Wild Hunt was equal parts combat and moral quandary - often having to do with killing or sparing the life of someone who may have committed crimes. The key here in all these is that the decisions a player makes can open up entirely new plot paths.
Warcraft does very little of this and I agree with the OP that the game (and the company making it) suffers a bit from this missed opportunity.
Right now I know a lot of Warcraft players just hit esc and skip cutscenes that cost a lot of $$ to create because the “RP” doesn’t interest them. Many don’t even read quests and instead, just look to the mini-map or an addon to see what to kill or gather next. Could it be that this is because the Warcraft storyline only appeals to the ‘goody-two-shoes’ heroes among us - leaving those who would prefer one of the other seven (potentially far more complex and interesting) alignments out on the doorstep?
Maybe with recent advances in technology (looking at you, artificial intelligence), the game can become more expansive - not just by adding new monsters to kill or new continents to explore - but by adding new plot paths based upon the ethical choices your character makes as it progresses through the leveling process and beyond.
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Ahh playing the monsters is so fun. I remember our whole pack of wargs (??) Getting dusted by this Hobbit.
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“The world will look up and shout ‘SAVE US’ and I’ll whisper ‘no.’”
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