yeah, i’d totally agree, there are other and more interesting ways to implement the system; that’s also true for the transmog question, so my understanding is that all that’s being discussed here is the principle of the thing, as i’m sure we all have our druthers on wow’s gameplay lol
good thing we’re not playing or discussing a different game, where that might be a problem, then
Imagine, there are no druids.
Druids do not exist.
Simply. they implemented green colored glyphs. And maybe the water elemental becomes a tree (why not.)
Would this be better for the game? Rather than a new class.
And being glyphs, they would be optional.
You asked me the difference between a Paladin and Priest. Again, those are two classic RPG classes where their differences are well defined. Evokers are an entirely original WoW class completely defined by how Blizzard presents them in this game. Hopefully you can figure out the rest on your own.
you’re not grasping the point of my comparison. we (or at least i) am speaking specifically of warcraft’s fantasy, not generically. and even if that were an issue (it’s not, that was never the point of the comparison in the first place), it still doesn’t get at the actual substance of the point, which is that, aside from the spec difference you even pointed out (which is a pretty obvious example of the difference between a mage and an evoker), there are a lot of overlaps in class fantasy in this franchise anyhow; you guys seem to have a really weak concept of ‘evoker class fantasy’ if one cosmetic change will ruin the entire thing
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i’m not sure i understand your question. if you’re saying ‘what if druids were merely a class skin for mages using cosmetics,’ i guess i’d go ‘hm, well, i know that class skins, e.g. necromancer appearances for warlock spells, are something else i’ve seen people float around as a cool idea,’ but i’m not sure what the relevance is here. what did you have in mind?
Instead of creating another class, people try to warp an existing class into something that they want.
Making it less unique. And something so far apart from the fantasy.
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Except the Evoker healing spec is half time/arcane based, and Mages in WoW classic also have the ability to heal via time/arcane magic. Slap on Chronowarden, and the Evoker healing spec is even more time-based. So no, it isn’t all that different thematically without the Dragon component.
Also it isn’t just a cosmetic change. You make the Dracthyr form optional and you alter the animations to essentially remove the dragon thematic from the class and you no longer have a dragon class. You have a variation of the Mage class.
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i feel like we’re taking a long way to get to the paradox of theseus’ ship in this thread, at times. what’s the amount of identity ‘sacrificed’ at any degree of change? the other genuinely baffling thing to me remains the influence some are permitting others to have over their enjoyment of a particular thing in a video game. i don’t scream at gnomes and dwarves that if they learn any profession that isn’t engineering or blacksmithing respectively, they’re ruining the races because ReSTricTIon iS ThE eSsENce Of FaNTasY
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i genuinely dunno how you adhere to this conviction, if it’s sincere, because it sounds genuinely really removed from reason to my ear. mages do not have spells that look like evoker spells. evoked spells are clearly themed after the five flights. many classes use the same type of magic for their abilities. nevertheless, the rest of us aren’t hopelessly confused by this situation and don’t require each class to all use different models to tell them apart, either thematically or gameplay-wise. i don’t think this conversation is going to continue productively if the simplicity of these points remains elusive
Restriction is the basis of fantasy.
If I want to be an elf, I can’t exactly have a non-elf model (officially.)
Sure, there are transmog toys and what not but the official character creation screen will not let me pick elf along with another character model.
Who knows, maybe a night elf that looks like a vulpera would be a fun thing to create.
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They don’t have spells that resemble Mage spells because many of their signature abilities take advantage of the draconic theme and physiology. However, if you alter the spells to make them work with the physiology of Orcs, Humans, Elves, etc. then there simply isn’t going to be much difference between the two classes.
Keep in mind, Blizzard created the Dracthyr race specifically for the Evoker class because they felt no other existing WoW race could properly portray a user of the 5 dragonflights. You unravel that, and you unravel the Evoker class, which I simply don’t see Blizzard doing.
Class homogenization would be another reason.
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i mean idk how many people missed the explanations for visages sprinkled all over dragonflight, but it’s not as though those aren’t part of dragon identity in the lore of the franchise. thinking of restriction as defining or even contributing to fantasy must be a really weird thing to square with the fact that fantasy as a genre is rooted very heavily in defiance of restriction, or that tauren paladins are somehow accessible to players, even though ‘sunwalker’ isn’t a class to which we have access as its own toolkit, and yet nevertheless people seem happy playing tauren paladins. i guess silver hand enjoyers learned to cope?
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lmao bro good luck figuring out raid comp when mages can be dracthyr and even use the dragon form. like damn, the time spells for arcane spec will prolly also have to change color to yellow, right? and damn, maybe they’ll also get green flower spells too, since mages are getting access to like the biggest thing that makes them different from evokers in the near future, apparently
Again, the separation point is the Evoker class having spells that require draconic physiology to work, like Deep Breath or Disintegrate. If the Evoker class didn’t have that separation point (essentially making the player a dragon), there would definitely be some overlap issues between it and other existing classes.
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If anyone could be anything and do anything they wanted, it would be boring.
We are dracthyr. Our visages have in game lines about them being imperfect. And only there to calm down allies
Nobody said visages can’t be in the game, just not as the main driving part of dracthyr. You have to be a dragon.
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My fav argument “just roll a mage”.
Evoker plays nothing at all like the other casters.
Blizzard should just delete everything except warrior, hunter, priest and mage then delete talent specs too.
No need for extra flavours they’re all exactly the same apparently.
Drachtyr tmogs need to be expanded but if blizzard are too lazy to treat the players model as nothing more than a shapeshift form then just the let the people who want to play in visage form do so.
It’s pure laziness to not give drachtyr real tmog (mechagnomes too) and no one should be defending blizzard on that.
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I know right. I love my evoker. It can hover around using its scaly wings and breathe fire out of their dragon mouths. There’s no other class that can do that. There’s no way anyone would want to turn those characteristics off.
You had the right idea to start, theres no reason to give them a bandaid solution that would only appease those who don’t care about the identity of the evoker. Just let us full mog our dragons.
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I hate when people are swinging around a two handed axe, carving up enemies and causing havoc but they have transmogged the axe into a mace, why would they ruin those characteristics.
Because of that I think blizzard should never have giving those players the option for more customisation.
But blizzard is all about their bandaids, I’d prefer a lazy fix now instead of a harder fix 10 years from now (which they will do on the laziest way possible anyways)
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