Just gals being pals?
2 Likes
Right, so good rule of thumb is that a complete sentence represents a complete thought. When you quote only part of a sentence, you’re very likely not addressing the actual point someone is making.
You have not managed to quote a single full argument before leveling a series of completely irrelevant responses. It is obvious at this stage you are trolling.
Now lets take a brief moment to examine how your responses look when addressing an actual argument, and not a convenient quote mining.
No, it wasn’t convenient. It was quite annoying to march north with the intention of protecting Zandalar. Only to discover we were needed south.
What’s further, nothing convenient was gained by falling for this ruse. The Horde forces, rather than defending fortified positions in Zandalar, had to fight through fortified Alliance positions instead. Which they did.
Irrelevant. Your mistake was claiming they forced Zandalari membership at this stage. The sentence you pretended to address was making that correction.
But where your new argument falls flat is the assumption that this was an occupying force. As we saw these forces were there to defend Zandalar, which they did do even if you’re unaware of it. Secondly, the dialogue between Talanji and Sylvanas indicates that she wishes to continue her alliance with the Horde. For the Horde to withdraw troops at that stage would be seen as abandonment of an ally, not the liberation of trolls.
I did, all two of your assertions have been refuted. The Zandalari weren’t forced to be members of the Horde. The Horde didn’t leave the king of Zandalar to die conveniently.
In that the context proved you to be factually incorrect, yes.
6 Likes
How many Horde casualties were there? Rastakhans deaths was convenient in the sense the Horde were given an easier negotiating partner in the form his daughter.
It’s not irrelevant. It’s the conditions under which these things were negotiated and deserves mentioning. They did not meet at an neutral bargaining table. The Zandalari did not join the Horde from a position of a strength. Her father was dead and her city was filled with Horde soldiers. Those are facts.
1 Like
Don’t hate that you don’t have a homie to play WoW with like me and Spuddyc.
The Zandalari are colonial subjects to the Horde.
Well Talanji needed their muscle and without the Horde, Dazar’Alor would have fallen to Zul and Ghuun’s followers and the Zandalari would have effectively been wiped out. Frankly the Horde also had very little reason to stick around with the Zandalari at the end because they went from a powerful potential ally to a costly investment in manpower and resources with little pay off. The Horde could have just washed it’s hands of the Zandalari and left them to their fate at the end of the Siege. In fact Talanji considers that a real possibility. If anything, the fact the Horde doesn’t just up and abandon the Zandalari is probably more honorable than leaving them to their fate. Talanji feared they would do just that. The Horde was in the middle of a war it was losing and not really in the position to be helping out third parties.
However the fact that the Zandalari ended up so pathetic by the end of this expansion and the general way the Horde side was treated at all, for me, has long been a thing I despise and I have made no effort to hide it.
Oh I played for years with my brother but he lost interest in the game before me when Blizzard once we hit MoP because he absolutely despised what Blizzard did to the horde by making Garrosh Warchief and if anything making Sylvanas Warchief just convinced him Blizzard’s view of the Horde pretty clear at that point. I am the sucker that thought Blizzard’s treatment of the Horde might change.
Anyway the Zandalari might be colonial subject of the Horde but at least they aren’t all dead from their own screw ups and hubris. Then again, the Horde isn’t exactly much better at this point anyway so I suppose that isn’t much of a win. Fortunately we now have Baine being Anduin’s mouthpiece to tell the Horde how not to be psychopaths and the Horde populous clearly is incapable of thinking for itself.
9 Likes
Your mask is slipping a bit there.
Considering Rastakhan was dying and so desperate to save his people that he made a bargain with Bwonsamdi while Talanji met Sylvanas face-to-face to declare them equals I’d argue Talanji was the harder negotiating partner.
5 Likes
Eh do you know the Zandalaris are just allies in equal terms even when the Horde was in his worse phase with Sylvanas?
Aside of that Zandalar got the best deal from all the races that participated in BFA which is not bend the knee and doesn’t go around hugging the contrary faction
2 Likes
I’m not 100% up to date on the council stuff. But with the warchief position abolished, shouldn’t Talanji (and the Zandalari) have just as much power and say in Horde affairs as any other playable race?
1 Like
Nah. My mask is on and I’m ready to mug some peeps in Orgrimmar. But I’m not sure what you call being occupied militarily by the Horde other than a form of colonial occupation. I like the Zandalari being on the Horde but there is no question about it that their addition to the Horde was rather humiliating for them. Hopefully they get shown in a stronger light in Shadowlands.
laughs in night elf, worgen, and draenei
Hell we still don’t know if Stormwind ever recovered from cata.
How on azeroth the zandalari are colonial subjects of the horde?
the horde was so desperate for their help in their genocidal campaign that they allowed talanji disrespect their warchief as long they can get their ships.
Anything for victory, right?.
Fanfiction.
5 Likes
Ships they never even got to use because they got destroyed due to the Horde using Zuldazar as a colonial outpost and bringing a pointless war to the shores of Zandalar. I feel bad for the Zandalari.
Well I don’t know man. When I observe the real world of a foreign army comes to the shores of another nation with its military and meddles in the civil affairs of that nation for its own benefits I usually declare that as a form of imperialism and colonialism. I think that can apply to what happened in BfA. I am against that in the real world, as I am in the fiction world of Azeroth. We need peace! 
1 Like
I disagree here still. Rastakhan turning to Bwonsamdi is exactly why he’d still be a more difficult partner. He was prideful and thought he was immortal with the Loa on his side.
I applaud you for the best comment. This honestly does make things a little bit different, as far as my little interpretation I wrote up goes. Without a Warchief the power is probably back down to the leaders of each nation in the Horde - which would include the Zandalari and Talanji.
2 Likes
Question:
Do the Zandalari ever express dislike or otherwise reject the Horde military force that is there?
1 Like
Off the top of my head I am pretty sure when the Horde player first arrives a Zandalari guard says “Dat is far enough, Horde scum.” before being allowed into the city because of Talanji.
The troll speakers, while not Zandalari, also have some really funny things to say if you check out their quotes.
But this is where I mentioned before that you are conflating several different periods in time in order to make your argument - there’s no Horde presence besides the one boat at that point in time, which is hardly an “occupation”.
5 Likes
After an unknown number of the nation (King Rastakhan says: Too many sided with Zul) turned against their ruler for a guy working to free an old god along with three other groups of invaders. The Sethrak, Blood Trolls, and Mogu all helped Zul when he attacked Dazar’alor.
It’s not them attempting to colonize Zandalar, it’s them offering aid to a nation that was just attacked by old god cultists who successfully unleashed an old god just on the other side of their border.
There was no Horde army in Zuldazar at that point, any “meddling in civil affairs” was purely the Horde player doing tasks for Rastakhan, Talanji, or members of the council.
1 Like
Just because some of your races aren’t economically wealthy and stable doesn’t mean you don’t also get ones that are.
Also the night elves were an economically powerful nation when they joined the Alliance. They only suffered their major losses much later. Same with Stormwind who as of Vanilla have pretty well recovered from the Second War.
Kul Tiras is mostly fine and better off than before the Alliance arrived. I can’t say the same for Zandalar. Then you still have a mostly untouched dwarven kingdom.
So what Horde nations are economically powerful and haven’t very recently suffered a massive culling before joining?
7 Likes