its a bad joke, after that excuse of a war campaign the only way to enjoy this game for me is to shunt off anything regarding the alliance/horde as a whole.
2 Likes
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/what-reparations-should-the-alliance-get/651847/111
There’s atleast one person that thinks the Night Elves brought it on themselves
1 Like
Yeah, I just saw that, lol. It was reaching all the way back to War of the Ancients, though, which I think is a stretch. Most WoW players (who aren’t into the lore) barely know what the WotA was even about.
2 Likes
That’s an alt of someone else that they like to RP on in the forums.
I can see how someone can justify attacking Night Elf lands because of the Kaldorei Empire when Azshara was leader but civilians shouldn’t be killed because of that
We even did it this expansion! We did it in MoP which was supposed to be a cooldown expansion! We did it in Classic at AQ when there wasn’t even a single overarching narrative! This “core of the game” red vs blue got wrapped up halfway through BFA anyways!
4 Likes
When the Alliance and the Horde go to war… they don’t play pattycake. Civillians are resources, they’re as valid a target as anything else when it comes to winning a victory. Both sides play it that way.
1 Like
please do not derail this thread its function is for future reference about all the times blizzard blatantly lied to us or at least misleaded us into believing something.
26 Likes
Browsing this thread has reopened all of the wounds that had been healing. I can’t believe the did this to us. Moreover I can’t see any scenario where the story we got could have looked like a good idea at any point in development.
32 Likes
BFA was written in large part to set up Shadowlands. KT, Zandalar, Azshara and the Naga, and the old gods. None of these things are really “expansion selling” features on their own so they tied it all together with a half baked faction war conflict. The only major character to die was Saurfang, and his arc was largely a rehash of Grom’s.
Tricked into doing violence->Becoming alienated and bitter about it->inspired by an idealistic younger character->fights the avatar of his past mistakes->sacrifices himself to redeem his people.
If anybody thought it was weird that Saurfang’s plotline got the CGI treatment while none of the characters actually relevant to the real main story of the expansion(the old god stuff) didn’t, this is why.
Sylvanas, meanwhile, is basically just Arthas.
She starts the expansion ostensibly doing what she thinks is best for her people(this has since been retconned, but she was absolutely written this way in Before the Storm and Good War)->At some point comes under the service of a death aligned entity->Commits Genocide against an Elf race->Is eventually forced out of her seat of power->Leaves to join her master.
They went all out to rehash a story that’s already been told and set up the shadowlands. And they burned down the Horde as a faction to do it.
26 Likes
I’m pretty repulsed that BFA was a “let’s ruin Sylvanas 'cause she sucks, the Horde is evil” expansion and this thread proves it.
18 Likes
For goodness sake, this deeply selfish, nihilistic route for Sylvie has been an option for her since EoN. If viewed through the lens of that short story, her actions and behaviors in Cata, War Crimes, and Legion reinforced it wasn’t just a possibility … but one of the most likely options. I’m not saying that she didn’t have other paths, but something like what we got has been a path for a years.
I mean, how many times in her history as a character does it have to be revealed that she is just using others for some personal objective, then discarding them the moment they cease to be of use before it stops surprising people? She’s been doing it since WC3 for goodness sake, but people just didn’t care back then because she did it to scummy people.
6 Likes
So were better routes. They didn’t happen! No more excuses!
17 Likes
I genuinely have to wonder how some Sylvanas fans can call themselves fans when they constantly ignore elements of her characterization that didn’t agree with their image of her? You don’t like the path they chose for her? Fine. But the route they chose for her is within the realms of the character they wrote. At least until she gets Kerrigan’d … which … might happen?
How anyone could come out of EoN ever taking anything Sylvanas said at face value I will never know. That short story totally recontextualized her relationship with her Forsaken in the worst of ways up through the end of WotLK. If you didn’t come out that shortstory at least humoring the questions: “Man, I wonder what would happen should her Bulwark ever become as worthless to her as her Arrows did? Think she’d discard them too? Think she’d abandon her “Alliance of Convenience” with the Horde once they ceased to be “Convenient”?” … I don’t know what to tell you.
3 Likes
Nothing in EoN or Cataclysm set Sylvanas up as the warmonger she was in BFA. She expanded Forsaken territory in cataclysm, yes. But this was during a war she did not start and it was done with the express motivation of increasing her power to shield herself from death.
So, say the world is in a relative state of peace, the legion is defeated, and both factions are in a tenuous peace. Why exactly would Sylvanas start a World War? She goes from a very remote chance of dying, to putting a target on her back. She loses the base of power she spent the preceding years building in the opening salvo of the war.
Yeah, totally in-character for Sylvanas. This is also totally leaving aside the fact that a character consistently portrayed as cold and calculating throws temper tantrums multiple times during this expansion.
Sylvanas fans actually read the novels/short stories and play the quests we talk about. It seems like all you haters just gloss over wowpedia and think you know enough to debate.
30 Likes
When a character is smeared very intentionally it shouldn’t be surprising that people don’t enjoy the narrative decision. Especially when it’s transparent malice for the character, and an entire faction is made to feel ashamed for picking the side they want to play as for a bad decision they had no actual choice to make. I’m not really interested in discussing this further with bad faith actors.
19 Likes
Kul Tiras, Zandalar, Azshara, Naga and Old Gods are perfect subjects that could be used for a South Seas expansion. The South Seas is a theme for an expansion that people have wanted for awhile now. I was excited for all of this in BFA, and if the xpac wasn’t marketed as being faction war themed, I’d be more excited. If those were the focus we could’ve still had some faction conflict, all that would be needed is that the Alliance recruits Kul Tiras for the purpose of going after the Zandalari since the Alliance can’t handle their navy on their own. The general story flow doesn’t even have to change for the most part, just cut out whatever isn’t relevant to the new zones.
4 Likes
As much as I love to debate Sylvanas as the next person DO NOT, Turn this thread into a Sylvanas thread, This thread is meant to showcase many of blizzards lies/ contradictions/ what feels like intentionally leading players on etc.
25 Likes
Sylvanas is a galvanizing and awesome character; its hard not to talk about her. Literally the 1st three interviews in this thread are about her. Posters are discussing her in the context/framework of the OP.
7 Likes
The sheer wtf of this.
The only saving grace is that Travis is only a producer, but what is he even saying. Please keep him away from anything important.
8 Likes