How is the Alliance not losing their minds over the Forsaken retaking Lordaeron?

Turalyon’s title became defunct along with the kingdom.

1 Like

Held… very much past tense.

They have south shore again

1 Like

It would appear the answer to this question is they were too busy preparing to recapture Gilneas.

Didn’t Calia convince the Forsaken Council to just give that to the Alliance?

She said she was going to try to, but there were no promises made.


Did they fix the blight?

Like do we have specific lore it was cleaned there.

forsaken need it for lebensraum

This isn’t true. First of all there are farmers under attack(actual Lordaeron citizens the Forsaken kill), Scarlet Crusaders, plus the entire eastern and western plaguelands is currently being healed. Alliance was directly fighting the Forsaken in the western plaguelands as well so they clearly want the land. Until Blizzard decided to drop that plotline and never follow up.

Second of all there are infinite humans orcs etc. “there aren’t enough” lol at any WoW argument with this. They can write as many refugees as they want.


It’s the same problem Games Workshop had in Warhammer Fantasy with “there are as many elves as the plot demands” (mainly associated with author Gav Thorpe). In that setting, elves are supposed to be a dying race BUT Games Workshop wrote stories where the death of a hundred elves was a tragedy and stories where the death of a million elves was brushed off by other elves. We need less of that lazy, clumsy kind of writing being in stories.



Stormwind isn’t the same kingdom tht was ruled from Stormwind Keep either tht kingdom fell to the Orcs and it’s survivors retreated elsewhere and refounded it afterward.

The fact of the matter is that the Forsaken, despite their changed natures are still the same people that were living there when Arthas gave the place a royal makeover. If the breathing survivors didn’t insist that Lordaeron’s other survivors be given a permanent dirt nap, we wouldn’t be having an issue.

1 Like

Well… setting aside the Forsaken being the citizens of Lordaeron raised into undeath… they also have Calia Menethil as a member of the Desolate Council. Kind of hard for anyone in the Alliance to lay claim to the kingdom when a literal member of the royal family is part of the Forsaken’s governing body.


Ehh brush up on your lore. Warcraft 2 was and the Second War had Stormwind fallen and it’s population utterly decimated to which only a few boats left Stormwind Harbor. These survivors settled in Hillsbrad during the Second War and Prince Varian was raised alongside Arthas and both grew up during the war.

At the war’s conclusion with an Alliance victory. The survivors were rallied by King Terenas, and boats filled with supplies and treasure was sent South to rebuild Stormwind. In particular, Southshore port was used and thousands of Hilsbrad/Lordaeronians left alongside the survivors of Stormwind as King Terenas knew the provinces of Stormwind were all, but exterminated.

When King Varian left he brought thousands aka a majority of Lordaeron’s people with him to repopulate his country as agreed by King Terenas. Hence why Stormwindians say, “Lordaeron is as much our homeland as Stormwind.” King Varian especially saw both kingdoms as his homeland. The survivors were later bolstered by refugees of the Third War as many made their way southwards.

It’s often forgotten, but the humans of Stormwind are actually mostly of Lordaeronian stock and many were adamant of rebuilding Lordaeron as a human kingdom and during Shadows Rising the two factions met in Arathi Highlands and we know how that ended. Lordaeron is now home to a scant population of Forsaken undead who could not easily take back Fenris Isle and that should tell you how depleted they are post Fourth War and Sylvanas Windrunner’s actions.

I don’t think Lordaeronian living want Lordaeron City anymore and many seem to have settled the Plaguelands under the Argent banner and Southshore/Hillsbrad post Fourth War which is the status quo we had in Classic. Humans hugging Southern Silverpine and Hillsbrad/Southshore. Forsaken firmly controlling Lordaeron City and outskirts still having human survivors protected by the Scarlet Crusade.


The cult of Forgotten Shadow is a branch of the Church of the Holy Light. Since many of the inhabitants of Lordaeron were killed during the Scourge invasion and were raised as undead. The only think that happened was the reaffirmation that the Forsaken are still the citizens of Lordaeron.

Once they made the decision to make Stormwind their home and Varian their liege, all claims to Lordaeron became moot when Arthas killed Terenas. He wasn’t going to be welcoming them back save as corpses.

As far as depeltion goes remember that Stormwind burned so many troops themselves during the Fourth War that drafting the farmers was at least being considred. That’s a pretty drastic state of affairs.

1 Like

More like a heretical offshoot.

1 Like

Tell that to shadow priests.

Don’t see any of them in Stormwind’s Cathedral, do you?

1 Like

I agree, but the average Stromwindian is in fact Lordaeronian by blood and culture, and that’s why King Varian called them, “sister kingdoms” by blood and tradition they are effectively the same people.

During Cataclysm humans attempted to retake Andorhal failed under the banner of Stormwind, and under the Argent banner retook much of the Plaguelands. Lore wise these humans have been breeding while the Forsaken have been losing massively. Attrition alone will make Lordaeron a human kingdom, but with Calia Menethil dead and now leading the Forsaken most humans of Lordaeron gave up the claim to the city proper as their last great hope now lies in Horde hands.

This is why Calia Menethil is so important. Legitimacy. History. The very existence of her as undead makes all living humans a far second to the Forsaken claims. While the living will continue to resettle Southshore/Hillsbrad/Silverpine and Gilneas. Not to mention the Plaguelands. All hopes for a Menethil led kingdom under the flag of Lordaeron has died. Only now the idea remains, and that will likely be reforged under the Argent banner, but if the Scarlet Crusade can bring these humans under their rule. We may be gearing up for another conflict between humans vs undead. This time with a resurgent Scarlet Crusade, but if the Worgen can retake Gilneas and somehow, they forgive the Forsaken and make peace. Then maybe we can avoid another faction war. All sides vs Scarlet Crusade… Though that sounds rather boring, but a likely outcome.

That spirit of sisterhood was sadly missing when the undead survivors of Lordaeron attempted to make contact with both Stormwindians and the Lordaeron refugees. Their ovetures were met with rejection and violence they were quite literally “Forsaken” by those who once called them fellow citizens.

In that rejection, they severed ties with the kingdom that rose from the ashes of the old.

I don’t know if a narrative combining Gilneas, the Forsaken, and the Scarlet Crusade can be made to work, but it would be interesting to see someone try. Maybe as a “B” story as opposed to an Expac’s A story.

1 Like