I have, but I hate the amount of preparation it needs to cast 1 viable PoH.
You first need lightweaver stacks.
Then you need to cast a holy word (Which can be a waste of HW because maybe everyone is just 100% hp but you need to prepare for big dmg)
Then you cast Premonition (Which can be a waste too)
Then PoH
I mean all of that just to get 1 powerful PoH… which isn’t even that impactful because AoE dmg just keeps going, and I have to coordinate that through all the AoE? no ty. It’s just better to keep cleaving healing with PoM and Heals/Serenity.
PoH is powerfull with all these modifiers applied, but the execution feels very clunky to me. It’s not comparable to how Rshams easily manage Chain Heal
You don’t need lightweaver stacks. If anything I think they overcomplicate it.
You can just use resonant. I don’t even talent into lightweaver (though I think you probably SHOULD talent lightweaver in some dungeons because you want strong ST - just… I wouldn’t ever think it’s a requirement for casting POH even if you are).
POH is also still usable during prayer circle. So you really only ever need to hold onto Sanc, which you should be generating more of anyway, and you should be using into AoE anyway.
Also if you really want to use LW into it, lightweaver can be stacked up to 4. There’s very, very few instances where you really need to be prepped for 4 PoH, but if you have to, you can just carry lightweaver stacks so you don’t have to flash or manage between.
I’ve been enjoying Empyreal Blaze/Burning Vengeance as Oracle with Divine Word. After popping divine word into HW: Chastise in an 8 priory my Holy Fire crit for 1.6 million which cleaved ~1.2 million damage with Burning Vengeance. Second Holy fire was a normal hit for like 908k with another Burning Vengeance cleave of ~681k. Plus the divine word stays up long enough that I was able to start spamming smites for upwards of 600k normal hits.
I’ve also found Divine Word makes HW: Sanctify pretty burly at large burst healing. Highest I’ve seen the initial Sanctify heal for is almost 2 million, I think that was with Premonition of Piety or Clairvoyance at the same time. Made for some juicy Echo of Light with all the other spot healing I was doing.
Honestly, what I like about all of this is how many different people like different talents for different uses and I think the Holy rework in that sense is a success: Every talent feels like it’s effective in usage somewhere and with some playstyle.
I myself am trying to roll with instant casts with Answered Prayers and getting a lot more Holy Words along with Lasting Words to get a +10% healing bonus on people.
If you don’t have lightweaver then you 100% rely on Apoth free PoH casts and Premonition free cast, otherwise PoH is too slow to cast in high keys.
For me being able to just drop 1 viable PoH only in those windows feels clunky. I prefer to save my premonition whenever I feel I need this cd instead of using it for just 1 big PoH.
Not saying your take is unviable, just not a playstyle I find comfortable. Maybe if surge of light also affects PoH would be cool so you don’t have to use a CD to make PoH instant.
This interaction is similar to Soul of the Forest from resto druid that using Swiftmends gives you the equivalent to Resonant word andmakes your next Wild growth (PoH) or Regrowth (Heal) big.
The difference and why I think SotF has better design is:
Rdruid can still do AoE healing while using Wild Growth. Hpriest needs to constantly be weaving Resonant words, managing HWs and also Premonitions to constantly keep AoE healing through PoH.
Rdruid activate this via a 12-15s cd so you have it almost all the time. For Hpriest you might find situations where your HWs or Premonitions are on cd.
Again a nice option would be that Surge of Light affects PoH so now you can easily weave PoH on demand when needed and prepare a Resonant Word proc for that without wasting a CD. Or maybe Empowered Renew could also proc Resonant Words?
Just ideas on how I would bake PoH more into a rotation for M+ without being clunky.
But that’s just me. I’ll stick to the same build I’ve been playing this season for Oracle Hpriest and use the PoH points elsewhere
This does not match my experience in 13s. You’re going to use instants a lot of the time, but I’ve had no trouble hard casting it with just prayer circle running.
Prayer circle is enough that you can cast it a couple times. You rarely need more than 2 anyway. Apoth often feels extreme overkill and I’m saving my third instant off divinity for after the apoth is over.
I do think Lightweaver is a pain, but I feel like you’ll be OK as long as you have either Lightweaver or Prayer Circle up. Having all of that setup could be required for much higher keys, though, and I do think holy has too much setup to get max output.
With that being said, there are many options, and you can play however you want, but I encourage you to keep trying it because it feels so much more solid than the Trail of Light BS. With Prayerful Litany, PoH is healing for more than Flash Heal on a single target even without Lightweaver. I don’t think it will be receiving anymore buffs.
Apoth feels absolutely ridiculous now. Being able to use our main AoE heals during it feels busted and so much fun. I really think Holy is about to pop off, and I’m seeing some Oracle in the top 10 on some of the raid fights which is making me nervous. I just hope that priest does not get nerfed again. People absolutely hate it when this class is on top.
Are you guys trying to force PoH? I don’t mean that offensively, I mean are you revolving around it?
Because honestly PoM picks up all of the slack. Renew, PoM, Flash Heals and everything combined picks up the slack. Putting out 4 PoMs in a row is really strong. I’m doing 7s and 8s and I don’t feel like I even need to use Apotheosis, it’s rare when I feel like I need it, which is a green flag for 10s.
I won’t be able to start 10+ keys until next week, I’ll be back after that with feedback.
Yeah that’s that high skill ceiling stuff right there, love it. I was eye balling that interaction, but I’m good on Divine Word, I prefer the Renew spread. (Divine Word reminds me of Shamans Earth Living weapon).
Holy Fire hits so hard, I’m pretty sure I had one crit for 4 million. Plus Chastise as an interrupt is under rated. We doing high skill ceiling around here, that’s why they jealous.
I’m curious about your Holy Nova findings, since you seem to be highly offensive minded? My Holy Nova has been critting for 2 million and it feels like it reaches max stacks super fast, it’s now a staple part of my rotation, I literally changed the bind for it.
Nope. If I’m forcing anything in my own build, it’s renew. I will insight empowered renews out and extend them through fights with more AoE to consider.
I’m not using Apoth in 10s for anything but damage.
It’s as you push to 12 keys where you’ll have a difficulty hike, and each key level after that is also a difficulty hike. It’s still not impossible - on the contrary I think Holy’s pretty OK, but still on the weaker side in M+ compared to other healers, but it definitely should be able to clear 17s if it hasn’t already. That said, PoM and Renew are absolutely not covering everything at all in higher key. You’re going to be playing Lightweaver heal/trail of light and a dream, or you’re going to play PoH to some extent.
Looks like it’s kinda hard stuck at 16. There’s 2 17s for the same dungeon, The Motherload.
As people max out gear level this should go up, but so will all the other healer specs, so everything should go up relative to each other, and holy will still be however many key levels behind it currently is if no other buffs/nerfs.
Nobody has even attempted on holy since the changes. Those 17s were both timed before buffs.
We’re also close to gear cap already. Or at least, everyone actively playing keys is. You’re not gonna be seeing huge swings anymore. Any further progress on key level is gonna be slow.
I agree with every word of this feedback 1000%. I just wish a dev would read this and understand the core issue: in M+, holy priests do twice the work for half the power of resto shaman. Holy has lost its identity as a reactive or easy healer; it now requires quite a bit of ramp, and it is no longer one of the easier healers (in M+, not playing it in raid atm).
Regardless of PoH, you’re constantly ramping for max strength Heals through some combination of Lightweaver/Premonition/Divine Word/Resonant Words/Apotheosis. I love that Holy is kind of based around spell combos/rotations, I just think this process could use some smoothing out (and buffing, it’s a lot to keep track of just to be by far the least desired healer anyway).
PoH build as Oracle for M+ feels much better than with Archon.
Prayer of mending is a strong AoE sustain heal that complements with PoH AoE, Archon lacks that so it’s way harder to play it
Must say I liked using PoH again. And found it quite viable at least for 12s with my Hpriest.
I think this is a right direction for Hpriest.
The bottom part of the spec tree is still messy and restrictive, needs tweaks and updates.
Agreed. Very restrictive. It does have multiple options now after the buffs, but still can’t do combinations you’d like to with the branching structure.
I found it was still mana intensive. Other high key non PoH builds have much better mana efficiency. I’m all about not having to drink after every pull.
The Lasting Words PoM build has been comfortable for me in 10s. I know there is a difficulty spike, but I haven’t felt remotely challenged yet. It must not even get hard til 12, which is an endorsement for Holy. I don’t know why people talk about 17s, it’s a fallacy to me because you have to have specific comps anyway.
People don’t have to obsess over Disc anymore in keys is more my point, even in 13s. Flash Heal does insane healing. You don’t need Lightweaver, Flash Heal is just insane.
I haven’t really been able to grind the past week or so. But really going into 13s my biggest problem is getting people who will let me play holy.
I could run my own keys, but I’m always getting keys I already have and I don’t have a ton of time recently.
Genuinely not sure how people are using a ton of mana with poh anymore.
Maybe over-casting it? Or super high key (but holy has problems casting LW heal there anyway). I basically only use it during prayer circle/with resonant words - and shouldn’t be spamming it pretty much ever. The only time it gets a little sketchy is when it’s like 3 packs of back to back constant healing (early priory, mechagon’s pipe after first boss, the 2 giant packs in cinderbrew). But for the most part, everything else has felt comfy and I’m barely drinking.
I kinda feel like you could’ve done anything else just as easily. In other words, if you only need PoH when you can prep with Sanctify then you probably didn’t even really need it. Just kinda hitting there with that setup to play with some new toys instead of really needing it to survive.
