Hello! Just dropping my two copper pieces about Holy~
1.) The loss of Rebuke HURTS and I get they don’t want healers to have interrupts right now but it still sucks :< please let me interrupt again the pugs do not press buttons that don’t do damage
2.) With the rework Holy is once again free to be entirely ranged given the fast CD on HS and Judgment, EXCEPT for when we need to cast Shield of the Righteous. I think turning it into a ranged attack (Exorcism perhaps~?) to keep us entirely ranged would be rad. It could change back to SotR if you activate Avenging Crusader for those who prefer to stay stuck in
Other than these two gripes I honestly love where Holy is right now :3c
4 Likes
I am loving prot more now that it feels nobody interrupts in dungeons atm. Avengers shield has never been more loved than it already is by me.
I haven’t tried holy yet but definitely on my table to play this expansion…it is a shame all but shaman lost interrupt though…-_-
Wasn’t lack of interrupting an issue beforehand and now they did this feels bad.
2 Likes
shield kinda sucks tbh. the mp return is meh…and i put a talent for some healing but it’s not that great.
it’s just a filler dps that’s melee. idk how i feel about it since it’s kinda underehelming, sometimes i get to spam it but i agree i feel like holy is closer to what i wanted to be.
2 Likes
I’d been hoping they’d make Denounce into a PvE talent, but so far, they’ve kept it a PvP talent.
It’s sad that the devs seem to have only allotted one iteration of serious changes for Holy—it’s like, once they figured out a rotation that was sustainable with very few gaps in it, they decided they were done with Holy, and never revisited it for any serious changes or paid attention to player feedback.
They really, really should have an early choice node in the tree that turns Shield of the Rigtheous into either Denounce or Shine of the Righteous: Shine of the Righteous was the Legion Remix version of Shield of the Righteous that allowed players who were wielding two-handed weapons to cast it, and honestly, that’s another thing that makes their redo of Holy’s damage kit feel half-baked: Holy still gets two-handed weapons as rewards from quests and such, but can’t really use them, all thanks to Shield of the Righteous de facto requiring us to wield a shield. It feels like such a tiny change that’d make such a huge positive impact for us; it’s another of those things that really puzzles players about what the devs are thinking.
7 Likes
Every Class should be able to use every single weapon type at its disposal without restriction, I agree <3
I’d love if they had a ranged damage spender besides SotR. Granted you can take Liberation and just spam heal spenders to do a little damage, but since that just got nerfed it doesn’t feel particularly good or worthwhile.
4 Likes
It has a few talents that might make it worth using more (the one where it heals people and the one that doubles its damage to the primary target) but idk if it’s worth it -v-
I know T^T
2 Likes
- Denounce
- Shine of the Righteous
- Dragonflight version of Exorcism
- Just letting us use SotR regardless of weapon
All of these are good options, I have no idea why none are implemented. At the very least, if they didn’t want us to have access to SotR without a shield, you’d think they would take 2-handers off our loot table. It’s kind of wild how they have solutions they’ve already implemented in other game modes, but refuse to implement here, and refuse to change the loot tables.
That quirk aside, so far I’m really liking how HPal is shaping up. Having a lot of fun healing as an aggressive Lightsmith.
3 Likes
The 2h vs 1h + shield thing continues to be obnoxious. Especially since most players craft weapons early and crafting a 2h int weapon saves you 60 crests early on.
It was pointed out repeatedly throughout beta and they continue to ignore it though so I guess they think the option makes sense and isn’t a trap?
If I’m not using BoV and not casting holy light that much, I may not care about the mana from SotR and all healer damage is laughable currently, so maybe I just go for the 2h to save crests anyway? Of course soloing and delving then feels awkward and paladins require different weapons and trinkets to play an off-spec.
5 Likes
Yeah I’d love to be a purely ranged holy paladin and would love them to give us some ranged damage option for spending holy power.
3 Likes
The class is still fun at its core, but there’s some “jank” in the rotation right now that being a melee healer feels clunky. Here are the main pain points:
-
Interrupts: Taking away Rebuke makes no sense. If we’re supposed to be in melee, we need an interrupt. Being a melee healer without one feels like we’re missing a baseline tool.
-
GCD Friction: Shield of the Righteous (SotR) really needs to be off the GCD. Right now it just stalls the rotation. If it were off the GCD, it would be a smooth weave instead of a “stop and press” filler. The healing isn’t enough to compete with true healing rotations but it would encourage us to get into the fray and hit things during low healing moment. (also feels fun)
-
Crusader Strke: Needs to be baseline or brought back with a talent outside of a buff window. Without it, there is no melee part of the rotation with just Holy Shock and Judgment. I’d like to be rewarded for being in melee and not reliant on a cooldown to turn on my melee power. Sure SoTR but we need a builder. Also, only having crusader strike during a window which activates a new button for our rotation just feels bad.
-
Weapon Choices: The 2-Handed vs. 1-Handed choice is still not there. Since SotR is the only real way to dump Holy Power for damage, you have no option for 2-handed which in my opinion should be the higher DPS option. If SoTR changed depending on 2-h vs 1-h that would be ideal.
Keep in mind these are just my thoughts, but overall I think the move to have paladin be the melee dps healer with disc being the ranged is great and I support it! I do think they should maintain a ranged healing option in the talent tree which they seem to have done already.
5 Likes
I personally like sotr being a melee skill myself. What I want to see is the mana return on it buffed so that it functions more like how melee did function for hpal back in those so called “We where fully ranged days” aka as a resource management/downtime tool.
I think it’s current iteration of being a downtime/resource management tool that ranged focused hpal players where ignoring is a fair compromise. It means hpals willing to engage with melee will be rewarded with more resources for later during lower points in a fight while the heal focused ranged holy paladins still chug along fine.
That being said, i’m also alright with it being replaced with SHine of the righteous from lemix since that would enable 2hander play. I just don’t want the last reason to play melee on hpal to go away.
3 Likes
Would put us back in line with Prot. I forget what their reasoning was for putting it back on the GCD. That was only done in Dragonflight again wasn’t it?
1 Like
I don’t remember the exact reasoning, I believe they put Holy’s SoTR on the gcd to make the rotation feel more stable due to the tuning at the time.
2 Likes
Take SoTR off the global and bring back crusader strike. Perfect
1 Like
- Holy
- Developers’ notes: We’re returning Crusader Strike as a baseline spell for Holy Paladins in this update with the intention of increasing moment to moment decision making and adding more variety to their rotation. We are introducing a second charge to Crusader Strike and look forward to your feedback on how that feels to play alongside Midnight’s other updates.
- Holy Shock no longer overrides Crusader Strike.
- Judgment cooldown increased by 83%.
- Crusader Strike’s charges are no longer decreased.
- Crusader’s Might now causes Crusader Strike to reduce the cooldown of Holy Shock and Judgment.
- Holy Shock’s cooldown is now 9.5 seconds (was 6 seconds).
- Avenging Crusader no longer overrides itself with Crusader Strike.
- Crusader Strike damage increased by 20%.
- Crusader Strike cooldown increased by 25%.
- Shield of the Righteous now reduces the cooldown of Crusader Strike by 1.5 seconds (was Holy Shock by 2 seconds).
Beta isn’t up so we’ll have to wait to see how it plays out.
But it certainly looks like our rotation is turning completely back to what it was before the pre-patch.
3 Likes
OMG No way! I admit that I was getting the hang of this current iteration but I’m also more then ok with this return to the rotation occuring.
1 Like
Just (crashed) off the beta. And my word.
It feels like garbage. The entire flow is gone thanks to the increased cooldown of Holy Shock and Judgement, requiring Crusader Strike to refresh their cooldowns. But the damage/healing of both those abilities weren’t buffed to compensate, it now just takes longer for them to do anything.
Where as on live, Judgement > HS > HS > Spender, just worked and flowed perfectly.
Now, with the return of CS and the cooldowns, the rotation because roughly Judgement > HS > HS > Spender > CS > CS, and trust me, it does not feel good nor does it flow well.
EDIT: Also, Crusader’s Might is once again mandatory, unless you want to sit back and spam FoL because all of your other spenders will be on cooldown.
6 Likes
That does sound concerning, when i get a moment i’ll review it on the beta and write up my thoughts on the matter.
3 Likes
I said before, I wanted Crusader Strike back, in addition to all the good stuff.
They could have just made HS turn into CS during AC. They could have done anything really.
Instead they just ctrl+alt+del the entire alpha/beta testing, and put is functionally back to TWW S3, except with the multiple number nerfs.
5 Likes