I’ve been playing with it on Beta, and my goodness, to each their own, but it feels so slow and boring. 3 attacks for dps, 1 of which is also a primary heal, and another requires hp. I thought maybe I was missing something on my action bars.
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As long as they remove crusader strike from Avenging Wrath again, I’ll be happy
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I feel like there’s nothing to press between heals. It’s such a slog.
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I feel like there is no time to press Flash or Holy Light because the entire rotation is filled up by Shock, Judgment and SotR.
Shock reduces Judgment CD, SotR reduces Shock CD, Shock has a chance to make your next Judgment give 2 HP and a chance to not go on cooldown when used, SotR has two independent chances to let you cast a free one immediately after use (which both reduce shock CD)
On beta, at least in my opinion, Hpal actually feels quite quick in terms of a damage rotation if you have Crusader’s Might, although how engaging that is will be up to you. I stress the fact that you need Crusader’s Might. This makes Holy Shock reduce the cooldown of Judgemet.
Basically casting Judgement on cooldown and both charges of Holy Shock to reset the cooldown of Judgement before using SotR to lower the cooldown of Holy Shock, by the time you finish casting Judgement, both charges of Holy Shock are back. Basically this engine never stops unless you use that Holy Power on either WoG and LoD or you just stop to hard cast anything else.
Now you can absolutely fudge that smooth rotation up by going Avenging Crusader, which will turn AC into Crusader Strike for the duration, but the engine will still be pretty much nonstop again, just now you have to use a different keybind. Personally I think it would flow better if it turned Holy Shock into Holy Strike instead of itself into Crusader Strike, but Blizzard stopped working on the game until January and the they’ll only have 3ish weeks until prepatch, so this is pretty much what we’re likely to be working with until 12.1.
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This is part of the issue for me. Crusader’s might feels so mandatory and in my opinion there are legitimate reasons for why you wouldn’t want to take it.
eg. You’re looking for more targeted healing. Greater Judgment is just likely to absorb a melee from a mob that would hit into your tank any way.
So you don’t take Crusader’s Might in search for more targeted spot healing (for M+ for example). What talent are you taking?
The rest of the talents in middle section of our tree offer dps from healing spenders, stronger AM, trickle healing on your beacons, LoD healing, CDR on LoH.
I think the only talent you’d consider taking is Divine Favor and so instead of casting Judgments, you’d be meeting the healing demand with cheaper and quicker Holy Lights.
With Divine Favor:
Holy Light
17,500 15,750 Mana
1.6 1.4 sec cast
When you don’t need Holy Light kind of big healing though what would you be doing to fill those rotational gaps that Crusader’s Might solves? Uninfused Flash of Lights?
I feel like there’s still a gap in the design and it’s a legitimate alternative to Crusader’s Might that solves the rotational issues.
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I agree. I mentioned it in the beta thread couple of times. The specs flow depends heavily on Judgement doing everything and Crusader’s Might not getting nerfed. That’s a huge design problem.
But as it stands, it is what we have and likely will get until 12.1.
Edit: If they are so against us having a separate button for Denounce, why is there no option somewhere in the tree turn Holy shock into it?
Say instead of Liberation being completely pointless, change it so Holy Shock does X increased healing/damage and no longer has cooldown, but has a (whatever sec) cast time.
But this would take away our only instant heal.
That’s what Divine Toll, Holy Prism, and WoG are there for. Perfect solution? Hell no, but i can see it removing gaps from a Crusader’s Mightless build and make it we’re still casting something that can either be a damaging spell or a heal.
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I warned y’all, it is really really bad, and with Blizz rushing out the pre-patch January 20th there will not be any more class changes until 12.1.
I predict Midnight will be WoWs worst expansion ever, most WoW players don’t follow the news/beta, they are all going to log in January 20th and find all the addons have been banned and all there specs no longer fun to play. Blizz will spend the majority of the expansion trying to fix what they broke.
It’s not just Holy Paladins, Holy Priests have it worse, the majority of specs are upset, very few specs have turned out better in Midnight.
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That’s strange…my own testing has more or less been that it’s pretty fast paced still. There’s such a lower cd on judgment and holy shock that you don’t have a gap in your rotation while cycling your dps skills, and when you do need to heal, you’re already using other heals in those gcds to build towards the next one.
While I do partially agree with Daiza that CM in its current form is mandatory, I’m wondering if that will still be the case once we have more haste? Both HS and Judgment do have hasted gcds.
Adding Crusader Strike back feels so weird. I really enjoyed Avenging Crusader on beta for the (very) short time where it let you cast Judgment→Holy Shock→Judgment→Holy Shock→Etc. The Judgments hit (and healed) like a truck, and alternating Holy Shocks let you easily spot heal a bit, if needed, or just direct it out as damage.
Now that AC turns into Crusader Strike, it puts us back in that weird spot where our Shocks are competing with Strikes for no good reason, and the Judgment healing was made weaker to compensate. Lose/Lose from my perspective, but I know some people really wanted melee healing. Unfortunately, it ruined the just-perfected AC and isn’t remotely what the hard melee-healing demographic wants (which is basically a type of Mistweaver).
I’d hate to have to wait until the last tier to do it, but would be interesting if we got enough haste to not need CM, and to not need to use SotR, so we could build Holy Power at a fast natural speed and do all our damage with other spenders and the Liberation talent.
I actually like bringing Crusader Strike back during AC as it actually gives it more of its own identity from normal Wings. It’s only problem to me is that it replaces itself with Crusader Strike which messes with the feel.
Im fine with Judgement taking the hit, because it’s simply doing too much stuff as is anyway. The loss of healing from it should be funneled specifically into Crusader Strike to prioritize it over HS for the duration of AC. Or us know, make HS turn into CS instead.
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Every single class is boring. Game doesn’t have any buttons anymore for anything. It’s just a housing game now with a few clicks. Everything is just bad bad bad. No need to try other classes. They don’t have any abilities either. Think they took out wasd too. Can’t even move characters anymore. /s/rant/skyfalling
what’s funny is the number of times I’ve done keys/raid and people didn’t use any of their utility - no interrupts, no defensives, no stops - I feel like it was these same people that would always complain about not enough keys to push. I’m just like if you played better and used all your tools there’s plenty to keybind.
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I feel this in my soul now.
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i just wish the hps felt better in beta.
This is just part of the game’s cycle. Give them 2 to 4 years and every spec will be cluttered with 1000 buttons again.
So just like every expansion then? 
Yeah, not feeling this at all. We’re very, very, very spammy. We can basically spam instants constantly. After healing 3 mythic 12’s on the ptr, I’m gonna need to move some keybinds to my lefthand because my right wrist has a bit of an ache.
Strange, my own experience with it on the beta has been the opposite. It feels just as fast paced and spammy as it does now, we’re just not juggling 4-5 different mini cooldowns to make our spells do more then lightly caress the target.
The only ‘slow’ moments might be when you’re casting Holy Light but if you’re using the rest of the toolkit you’re only using it sparingly for triage, and there’s the Divine Favor talent reducing it’s cast time to feel more reasonable.
To me it feels like the same average APM as retail, just between fewer buttons. Which to me honestly…it’s a good thing.
Noob to HPal here, I was just wondering what causes SotR to lower the cooldown of Holy Shock or if that is still a thing? I was looking around the talent calculator for Midnight and didn’t see what would do that.
It not only still does that in Midnight but also restores mana now so it’s very impactful for your rotation.
Also shining righteousness gives it about 3x the chance of proccing Divine Purpose as your other spenders so you can get alot of value from back to back sotr if there’s a low damage moment in an encounter.
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