I liked Glimmer of light a lot, being able to consume glimmer was a very nice way of glimmer management. for me the problem with the paladin was how weak the rest of the stuff was. If MW can do stuff with the mists, we can play around glimmer. I understand we wanted simplicity and we kind of got it. but now we have new stuff to track like dawnlights and weapons. also what makes broken the tier set is that you might have divine toll every 30-25 seconds now. which is great.
Glimmer, while fun to manage, is atrocious for the spec. Adding more healing over time through the tier sets is horrible. Almost worse than glimmer. It will appear as helpful contributions to HPS but current damage profiles do not need or benefit from hots. Let alone the length of these hots being added.
They inflated our HPS but in no way is the HPS coming in a meaningful/useful/intended way.
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Which was exactly the problem with glimmer. Because it could with enough haste,blanket an entire raid and provide ludicrous amount of healing on it’s own, everything in our kit had to be balanced around that possibility.
So everything we had had to be tuned to be was terrible, unless it buffed glimmer.
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We have also now a pretty sizeable of our overall coming from Dawnlight/Sun’s Avtar and Tempered in Battle/Hammer and Anvil/Holy Bulwark from hero specs, all sources of passive healing, on top of Veneration, Truth Prevails, Greater Judgement etc etc.
Imagine if they suddenly buff something like Tyr’s too.
On a side note, was playing yesterday just filling vault, and oh lord how I gonna miss how AC windows gave you the capability of reducing Judgement CD to spend BOTH infusions procs without having to even touch a freaking cast in melee.
Honestly, I do feel dissappointed that they made AC viable with LS (which feels like it best iteration yet), and instead to try and make it work with our current kit, they just nerfed it and thats it.
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The thing I’m going to miss the most is tempered in Battle. Absolutely insane ability. The only thing that would make up for its loss would be to become gods of spot healing.
Dawnlights are so boring, even if it feels like we have infinite throughput
Hammer and anvil rng sucks. Sure it gives a moment of relief when it Crits, specially when proccing awakening, or during wings, but it’s not reliable and skill related in any way so that’s cheeks
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It’s one of my favorite abilities ever as Hpal. The amount of control and HP stabilization is insane, and maximazing that CDR from Infusions felt cool as a minigame (though this was actually a complain of Hpal not long ago, with too many things going on, and now we have to track and optimized both armaments either offensively or defensively because of how strong sacred weapon can be both ways).
Really wished standard AV:M LS was a thing but I feel like with current tuning and gameplay is not it at its current iteration.
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I wish the cooldown timers were swapped for the two wing types, or honestly, both on a minute. There’s really no need for 20ish seconds of infinite throughput when compared with the option of more frequent
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you see when I said AC LS wasn’t that brain dead like 2 months ago? it’s interactive with the management of blessing assurance and the IL procs. This version of Hpal is fun. you feel like a paladin healer fighting and pumping. I am dissapointed in blizzard and I don’t want them to change it unless they passivly add Holy shock.
But it’s what it is, the devs are so affraid of a DFs2. but is totally fine when is DFS4 and TWWS1. nonesense
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I want to contribute a bit more of my opinion. I don’t want the lack of opinions shared to mean that hpal is in a good spot. It’s not, it’s almost seems there not enough people that care enough to continue advocating. Hopefully I’m wrong.
I appreciate when blue posts include the reasoning behind changes but it’s unfortunate there’s no explanation for the blessed assurance nerf.
Why nerf blessed assurance? I recall it was buffed and left that way. Is it being nerfed because their outrageous negligence honestly took this long to realize? Is it not possible to see how “mid” the damage and healing is at this current value?
Why do they continue to make changes pushing “casting” when we literally only have 2 casted spells and are classified as melee.
( Side note, I genuinely appreciate the ability to weave in and out of melee, the range of judgment, holy shocks, a flash/HP if I miss position) but it seems were being ping pongd between melee and range.
I would like to know the intentions of the class design. I would like to know where they collect information to influence changes.
Also,
Avenging crusader is fun because of the dynamic between damage and healing, and the minute cooldown. It’s downside has been argued to be the dramatic change in spell priority.
Wrath is fun because of the genuine power it brings. Dawnlights play a large factor and should just be reworked to something that results from player decisions rather than free passive healing. (Please no more HoTs)
It’s issue is the two minute cooldown.
A good compromise for literally everything would be either
- combine the two types of wings. Keep the 20% healing, DMG and crit, balance the current health transfer on judgement and crusader strike to account for the 20% bonus
Or
- Make wrath the only wings, reduce it’s cooldown to a minute. Make judgment and crusader strike heal the same as they do currently (or 20% less since wings would modify it) no reduced cooldown.
The intention of these wings modifications is that, we gain the strength of current wrath, the value of current crusaders cooldown and perhaps most importantly, we gets melee damage converted to healing, while also having a version of wings that makes any gcd valuable.
Devil’s advocate is that I’m asking for too much or it would be too powerful .
The intention is that wings should not restrict our rotation into, predominantly 3 spells give or take, and we get to play both melee and ranged at the same time.
With either type of wings the goal for judgment would be that it’s not a wasted gcd during significant AOE DMG, but also not so strong that you don’t need to continue healing with other abilities. Crusader strike healing would generally be for more maintenance healing (but should heal a noticeable amount, unlike light forged blessing, or veneration, those are pitiful)
- thank you for reading that all, if you did, and, do you have any ideas on class direction or opinions on the suggestions I made about our wings and the pull between melee and ranged? Or any thoughts about transparency of class direction or nerfs/buffs from the devs
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90% buff to Holy Light is a boon for casterdins, and adds a lot of value to Resplendent Light, so that’s neat. Rest of it is mostly a wash, though it’s nice to have access to Unbound Freedom if we want, for specific encounters or dungeons if we need it.
The class-level nerfs make me sad. If healing was too high on these abilities for Ret/Prot, or if these specs were doing more group healing than Blizzard wanted, the solution in my view isn’t to nerf them to worthlessness, just move them out of the class tree into the Holy spec tree.
Lightforged Blessing is especially unfortunate, as I loved it back in Dragonflight when doing M+. Let me contribute moderate extra damage with SotR instead of a healing spender, while doing a small amount of passive healing to my party. Now it’s gone from a small amount of healing back to a tiny amount of healing, and of course it only affects 3 characters this expansion, rather than the 5 it used to. I hate that it keeps getting nerfed, and doubt the minor dps increase to Consecration previously will make up for it.
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This is how I feel as well. We were giving feedback non stop on Hpal after the S2 DF mess and it took blizzard almost 10 months to even do anything about the state of the spec. Which was borderline unplayable at the time, being the only F tier healer.
I feel like this is close to that time. Hpal is not as weak as S3/S4 imo, but I just dont see enough people advocating for it as much as people saying it was bonkers when it is actually strong like in early beta for example.
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I’ll just keep doing that because no other class is enjoyable enough to keep me subbed.
I wonder why they don’t balance raid and mythic Plus differently, might make things easier. I know they already do a bit.
What was it, disc priest atonement does 100% more when not in a raid group, or something like that. It’s possible
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Tbh the raw changes to Holy’s spells are broadly speaking good. Infusions making Flash of Light stronger as our fastest casted infusion spender is a good change. Holy Light being more powerful all the time means we aren’t as constrained to try and line up Divine Favor and an Infusion charge to make it worthwhile to cast at all.
In dungeons at least, it’s wild to me that Dawnlights make up so little of our healing breakdown when they’re the focus of one of our hero talents.
I dont think casted spells even matter at this point. And it’s not even a tuning issue, they just have no real use other than filler or to desperately heal if you are out of position, and even then, they feel miserable to use and clunky at best.
They dont have much of a place in current hpal design and 9/10 hpals nowadays dont like them either.
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Frfr, I don’t have the will anymore. My entire friend group fell off because TWW Season 1 was Season 1, and I just don’t have the will to hope the spec plays well and if it doesn’t suffer through it or reroll. I’d rather just play other games this time if things are very bad. While I’m sure if we’ll be in that dire of straights again, you really never know.
It just gets exhausting to ether have your class play like garbage forever with no end in sight, or having your spec change every patch and it’s like you’re constantly relearning if you enjoy your class or not.
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Well… yeah, those are their exact use cases. Like I said, Holy Light being at minimum reliant on Divine Favor to bomb enormous heals into a Beacon of Virtue window or spending one/two Infusions on a soon to be far more powerful Flash of Light as filler or desperation is an overall gain to the spec.
Pure caster paladins and pure melee paladins simply don’t exist as the spec is designed, nor should either of them. Really what seems to be missing is a buff to Holy Shock, or buffs to key components of either Hero talents imo.
While I don’t think the buffs to FoL and HL are bad, I don’t feel like they are…good. Because the spells themselves still feel boring to press. Blizzard only seems to think “If we can make them move health bars, people will use them again.”
Despite making it so FoL is just generally too weak to keep people alive in today’s damage environment and hard casting HL will feel bad no matter how much of a bomb heal it can be.
I’d say make Infusion FoL’s instant and dropping HL’s cast time down to 1.5sec or whatever it used to be again would be a great start, but then you run into an instant FoL competing with WoG, which would likely cause problems again.
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I’ve never really understood this complaint. The spells move health bars and generate holy power, and they’ll be doing so with a lesser reliance on RNG procs imminently.
That said, I’ll always support fast cast holy light infusions returning. Legion Hpal was peak design for the spec imo.
While I understand making flash of light instant with an infusion, it really just becomes another Holy Shock. I’d like to see “instant” uses of infusions remain with greater judgement.
Them just moving health bars doesnt make them enjoyable. WoG doesn’t feel good just because it works, it feels good because before I even cast it, i have to set it up and then drop it, which feels good.
Where old Holy Shock, back when it had a higher crit chance, felt good to press because this could be the moment you get that crit and see that big green text and proc Infusion.
Holy Light and Flash of Light, on their own are just heals. That do nothing else interesting. They are basically Crusader Strike, their only purpose is to get us to our fun abilities faster. But Blizzard wants them to matter, but they only do so making them stronger, which still isn’t fun.
It felt good when i got an Infusion and used it on a instant FoL or a faster HL. It made casting them feel like a reward, which is fun.
Because alternatively, unless they just make them that broken you’re likely better off not wasting the mana on either of them and as you said just use Judgement instead, leaving them as boring filler spells. In recent memory the only time HL didnt feel like a filler was when you buff it with to make with Divine Favor or whatever that cooldown was called which was also still not particularly fun because it was attached to a minute/30 sec cooldown and really highlighted how badly the spell was tuned.
Filler spells they keep trying to buff until we actually do use them for a patch before they likely nerf them.
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Holy Light will, and I’m thankful for that. Flash got a 25% nerf though, with infusion buffing it back to about normal. So Holy Light will be more reliable but Flash of Light will require Infusions to do anything at all. It’ll be interesting seeing how that affects gameplay, as Holy Light isn’t likely to really need infusion at all most of the time anymore to be effective, but FoL will, and will be especially effective with it and especially ineffective without it.