Hear me out,
If I get a Guardian Druid tank… are people going to make a fuss that I’m a dps or target caller in Rated bgs? I like my DH way more than my warrior.
Has anyone done many rated bgs 1800+ as Havoc?
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DPS wise? Not all that great, in group fights usually get burst because we can’t handle a go, as vengeance great flag carrier or flag sitter. In most cases you’ll be asked to tank by pug groups. Havoc does ok damage but we die to fast to really be helpful in group fights.
Did RBGs as a Tank DH with a Havoc raid leader. We kept making jokes that we’d do better with a Ret Paladin instead of him, but he formed the group and we were winning so we didn’t care.
Sad to hear, but at least we have a slot I guess… 
You’re hard pressed to find a group that will take you because you are an easy target. Mobility is our speciality and it won’t save us in a meta based on CC and burst from druids and mages, you will get ccd and die. With that being said we are outclassed by WW monks and Ret so much that you won’t be viable past 2100. Speaking from my experience, everyone will wonder why you aren’t vengeance because they are great at spinning the flag vs rogues with immolate armor+demon spikes and spec sight. With that being said if it’s your group all that matters to your team is if you win and it is technically possible up to a point where every player is elite. Havoc actually makes a great second TC because the hunt is a huge move and can be used from very far but for a minute and a half afterwards you will be too scared to engage a pack of casters and have little to offer outside of assisting. This is clearly what blizzard wanted or they don’t know what xpac they’ve made because it’s been like this for all of Shadowlands
Another problem than just poor damage is the fact that the class doesn’t bring any utility to a group either. It’s a similar problem with Hunters. Their class literally brings nothing but damage (great damage btw) but because their damage is on par with things like Mages and Balance druids who do actually bring meaningful utility, they’re ignored.
So the problems with this class go well beyond just their absolutely dreadful single target damage. We could do amazing damage and the class would still likely get limited attention in RBGs and because their utility is largely stuns they are limited to DPS comps as well.
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Brings up another issue which is our one amazing utility we have to offer (Darkness) is too hard to see and coordinate, its impossible to see what team placed it too… for a 3 minute cd it should look like one, not some meager purple noodles. It should be cast like a sigil, for the clutch saves and it should look like actual darkness… not whatever is going on currently…
Darkness is just poorly designed. No class is going to sit in a grand melee relying on RNG to avoid 70% of incoming attacks when nearly every single class in the game is mobile enough to escape and avoid the damage completely.
Imagine how much more useful Darkness would be if instead of being a field on the ground that only protected people within instead applied a constantly refreshing buff on the player that entered the field that provided a few seconds of the darkness effect. That alone would be a rather simple change to make with a rather substantial improvement to the class.
There was a god tier havoc who was doing 2mil in RBGs. Next highest was a lock at like 1.5mil, and then no one on either team broke a mil. I didn’t check his build (kicking myself), but was probably hunting through as many people as possible to spread the cleave. I’m sure it’s doable, but be prepared for more opposition the higher you climb.
I applied to 19 different 1500/yolo groups yesterday and got instantly declined on every single one despite having high ilvl/cr. The challenge isn’t doing well in rbgs. It’s overcoming the stigma surrounding havoc right now and managing to get invited in the first place.
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If you’re good you’re good and people will acknowledge and realize it. The damage havocs output in RBG from a good one is big. Survivability is and never will be an issue in RBG when you’re playing with a team and not peeling away from your team trying to chase a kill to get baited into a death. Good healers and good havocs know how to deal with this. Stick with your team and you’re solid. As for your chances of finding an RBG group… GL cause its next to slim. There’s better options out there and groups dont actually start understanding class/comps until 2.1k ratings. 1800 is a cake walk and only requires you knowing your class
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https:// luduslabs DOT org/sotl-rbg
Great read. Havoc actually perform better than expected in RBG. Now to convince the world…
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That site uses data on logout. I’m sure almost all of those DH like myself swap to veng for RBGs, and then actually play havoc outside of that. It picks up what you log out as, so not reliable DH source.
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They won’t even take you to 1400 groups with 220 gear as Havoc. Havoc just melts in team fights or 1-1 . Dosent have much CC. Brings little team utility or buffs. Any other DPS is better .
Now if you play Vengeance , you can get into every group.
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I’ve queued up to 2k mmr yolo’s because I queue with my arena healer and other friends.
Havoc does fine in RBG’s until you’re in a real bracket like 2200+.
Like arena, just play smart and you can do well. Ignore the hyperbole of “you won’t get invited anywhere” because most people are just looking for a pulse compared to 100% a comp group etc.
Blizzard is known for catering tweaks to high end play over casual. if you don’t see anyone running Havoc DH in high rating rbgs, then how much more obvious can it be that something needs done?? from what ive heard, they are working on a lot of pvp talents, we can only hope havoc gets some big help in the single target department because its fun to play up until 2100ish where every little bit starts mattering. illidans grasp would be awesome to have as havoc
Notice I said until you’re in a real bracket. Fortunately OP mentioned 1800ish because I doubt they’re pushing for Hero if they’re asking for viability on the forums.
Havoc is very capable of getting you an 1800 set to enjoy and have fun while doing it.
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While any class is capable of pushing 1800 or so, the problem comes when trying to find a group to push 1800 with. I’ve found the only teams I find for 1600+ are those that started lower and I play with or ones that I specifically form. DH is hardly the only class to run into this problem, but it is a real problem.
I mean meta specs are always going to find it easier to find groups than off meta specs. Having to look a little harder doesn’t mean people won’t invite.
Also try queuing in a group. Queueing with a friend will help your chances of getting successfully invited, especially if you’re a bit undergeared but your friend isn’t. Networking with friends goes a long way in this game.