I can see your point. I can’t really comment. When I talk about being a solo player, I go all the way lol. I’m not sure I’ve ever done mythic or anything like that, so I have no idea what that’s like. I did normal raiding once back in Warlords, iirc. xD. Vote kick abuse and other group toxic behavior is just the nature of online game. It happened before LFD and it happened after. It happens in all other MMO games too. It’s not just a WoW issue. But that’s all me ranting and not to the point of the post.
Like I said above, I’m not sure what Blizzard, or anyone, could really do to “fix” anything. I think any big change would just end up with one side feeling alienated. Which also sucks. That’s probably not a helpful comment, but I’m honestly just not sure.
Biggest thing is we just have no modern standard place TO socialize, instanced content is rushed in retail and so is the level grind to get there in the open world, where and when are you going to make friends?
Other MMORPGs currently don’t have this issue because either the world and leveling are designed to facilitate socializing and networking, they have places to actually socialize in, or both. FF does this both ways, with the more story centric slow burn leveling as well as having whole areas of cities dedicated just to relaxing with friends and making new ones.
Modern current WoW lacks that, most of our zones aren’t even really meant to be lived in on a regular basis, many of them don’t even have working chairs. Heck, even of the two main faction capitals, one of them is deserted depending on which server you’re on, and Org doesn’t even have functioning buildings with interactive furniture.
I used to be in an active guild. We raided, ran dungeons, would occasionally do old content for achievements, etc. It was great at the time.
But I’m older now and have other life things going on. When I log in, I just want to have a peaceful hour or two in which I do what I want and I don’t have other people relying on me. And I certainly don’t miss the hours I spent outside of game making sure I understood the raid fights and what I needed to do to make my gameplay better. That took time that I no longer have.
I… I dunno. I mean using FF as an example. I play a lot of FF, and I kind of put it on the same level as retail. Most dungeons (read all the ones I do) are through the roulettes (FF’s LFD for those who don’t play) and the cities hubs are…I’m not sure I consider that socializing really. I mean maybe. I think they work just like the city hubs in WoW. (Or at least did when I played more. I literally just came back to WoW last week ish) I think I’m maybe not seeing the same FF that you are.
Yea, I agree. I’m even in a FC (Guild) in FF and I still am about as social as I am in WoW. (That is to say I’m). I’ve really only had one MMO where I’ve ever done the full social MMO game and that’s because the player base is so low that you literally know every other player, and that’s not something I’d really wish on WoW or FF14.
People are more rational than we give them credit for. If they have a reason to do something, they do it. If they don’t have a reason to do something, they won’t.
When I play retail these days, I don’t socialize at all. Whenever I can solo, I solo. This is not a complaint against the game - I’m perfectly content with this, and I’m perfectly happy with the game this way.
There’s just not much reason to talk to people. The game is easy, it’s easy to move around quickly, and there’s so many things to get done. Stopping to talk would just slow me down.
This is in stark contrast to how I played in vanilla. I spent plenty of time talking to people then.
You’re probably partly right, but we can’t base our entire perception on the premise that the entirety of WoW’s player base shares the character flaw of entitlement. Unless there is something about the game that specifically draws entitled people, we should assume that the player base is more cross-sectional than that.
It’s just like anything else - if there’s not much reason to do something, people won’t do it. If a professor offers extra help sessions, but there’s no exam or project coming up, most students won’t come. If a sports team is at the bottom of the standings with nothing to play for, people won’t bother to watch. If joining an in-game community doesn’t fit the play style of an MMO, people won’t do it, or they’ll find somewhere else to go to talk.
As I said before, none of this is a problem for WoW, per se, but if the company’s goal is for this game to be an engaging social experience, they might want to start thinking a bit more about their strategy.
I dont how you make a person not wanting to be social…be social.
If a person plays retail under the premise they will absolutely not be social…how do you force them?
There are plenty of opportunities to be social right now. If people are ignoring those routes, and still complain WoW is not social…that is where I will call foul.
And most of those opportunities are being utilized via guilds and static groups. There is zero incentive or reason to socialize with random players in hub cities. There zero incentive or reason to socialize with people in “bite sized” group content like LFR, BG’s, or queued dungeons. There zero incentive or reason to socialize with people in M+ pugs or even raid pugs. You can join each of those, complete the tasks, and go on with your day. Making friends and engaging in lively discussion isn’t going to occur organically in that kind of content. Once in a while you meet a pug who you might eventually get to join your social group which generally is a guild. It’s inside those that the social aspect occurs more frequently. But outside of your guildies or friends you’ve made over the years what advantage is there to be “social”? Not a whole lot.
I guess my question to that though is…is that necessarily always a bad thing. I mean I get that if you are looking to socialize in those situations it’s kind of a bummer. That said; should people who just want to play those systems as they are set now (That is without a sense of “forced” socialization) be made to social more even if they’re rather not?
And I said, people use those and thats where the vast majority of socializing takes place. Outside of a guild/static group, what reason or incentive is there to socialize? I don’t need to hear your life story and get chatty while we run LFR, and even if I wanted to do that the in-game ability to do so is woefully inadequate. The in-game guild finder is nearly useless. Party/Instance chat and DM’s are really a good way to hold a meaningful discussion mid boss fight and the built-in voice chat program is barely above worthless. So people are left joining guilds and chatting on a 3rd party chat programs or websites which to outside observers looks like little socialization is happening in game.
“EverQuest’s community is nothing but a bunch of .” --a fellow Vanilla WoW player back in 2006.
MMORPGs were NEVER the proper place to socialize, make friends, and have a laugh, especially when that was considered more of the “purer” genre experience.
WoW had an edge because it was Warcraft, and it was Blizzard. That brought all the Warcraft and Blizzard fans together. If you liked Warcraft, Starcraft, and Diablo, you had something in common with the others. However, if you’re raidlogging MC/BWL/AQ/Naxx, that doesn’t leave much time for socialization.
Just keeping it a buck there. That means it was like this for as long as I remembered it. It just is, really. Either you already knew how to DIY on socialization or you didn’t. Either you were already well-adjusted in spite of the game or you weren’t. WoW didn’t change that either for the better or for the worse.
I think I basically agreed with this general idea?
The only thing I really added was that LFR, LFD, delves, ,story mode, etc. They are all things people ask for.
That outside of something like cross realm, most of the reasons of the lack of socialization have been self inflicted through players feedback.
I also strongly believe that the people who want in game socialization the most, are also the people that want LFR/LFD/Delves/solo play etc. Not saying that this applies to everyone. Only I believe that overlap there is the strongest.